Elaine character degraded to "slut" status.

Basically in the past two years the Elaine character has undergone a complete overhaul and metamorphasis. In two years massive changes have taken place, such as: 1) Hair has become darker, straighter, "cooler", and more "hip". 2) Attitude has become meaner, harsher, and more verbose. 3) Character has become extremely permiscuous and untactful. 4) Wears "cool", "hip" clothes, such as shiny, lose tops with large collors, and black pants.

I've noticed an increase in use of profanity and disregard for others. A good example of this would be how Elaine kept calling the man sitting next to her on the plane she was on in "The Butter Shave" a "vegtable lagsangna". Elaine also participates in an incredible amount of sexual permiscuity. Sex, sex, sex, and more sex is about all that her plot lines involve.

This kind of untactful behavior by a sitcom character is nothing new. We see similar attitudes and behaviors by other sitcom characters tapered all over today's "hip" new comedies. I guess the writers got the genious idea that turing Elaine's character into a SLUT would be original and funny. Boy are they wrong. It is this kind of immaturity and brashness that is exhibited by the Seinfeld writers that shows me how low the show has dropped.

Justin Tribble Sedona, Az.

Hey Now

Justin Tribble wrote in article ...

Kinda beating a dead horse here. But I wholeheartedly agree w\ you about some aspects of this change. Then again, others I do not. For example, Elaine has always been somewhat of a shady character as far has her past sexual history goes. I even once said here that she musta done it w\ all the upper westside. So this really isn't a change, but maybe it's been more focused in later seasons. Sex and Elaine go hand in hand on this show. Because it's just part of life they must incorporate it into the show. And for my eyes, she is the best pick for that. Just picture a lineup and see who you would like to carry the ball, so to speak, in terms of entering in sexual connotations thoughout the series: George, Jerry, Kramer, or Elaine. George...hummm....hummmm.......na. Jerry.....maybe, but he is to neat and clean(not that there is anything wrong w\ that). Kramer......well.....maybe.....hummmm.. ok ok, no. EEEEEELllllaaaine, ahhhh perfect! As for her change in apperence..THANK GOD!! Being that it's been around for awhile, fashions change! It's alright for her to also change her vision and choice of expression though her clothes. Just imagine yourself 7 years ago. Yikes, huh! =) So, imho, ya just gotta cut the lil New Yorker some slack.

nfa lincoln(who can't believe he is defending a sitcom character @ 11pm on a Sat. night =(

"Lincoln Mongillo" wrote:

"Elaine does the Upper West Side" was a name of a porn film Kramer is supposedly shooting a documentary around during the Bald Cure episode. She's in that little robe, hair wet. Good God. AM I NOT JUST A MAN...HOW CAN GOD DENY ME LANIE?

I'm okay now.

WT

"if the truth will set you free and knowledge is power, what the hell am I doing watching so much TV?"

OK, whatever...

Ph. D??? AHH AHH HAH HA HA *LOL* WAAA HA HA!!! That's funnier than anything on Seinfeld this season!

Justin T.

[email] (WT Pfefferle, Ph.D.) wrote:

Yes, Elaine is becoming a slut! She buys condoms and sponges by the case and all she talks about is men in prural!

The show has simply dropped to such low levels as to use sex CONSTANTLY for CHEAP LAUGHS. Yes, there was sex in the old episodes, but they didn't dwell on it and try to drag in laughs from it, like many other shows do.

Justin T.

"Lincoln Mongillo" wrote:

Come on, Justin! It's almost like you're looking for a reason to hate Seinfeld! Many episodes have had sex as a theme, and many of the characters use sex as motivation! For example:

*The Constest-- the whole gag was sex related. Granted, the topic was autoerotica, but still: sex was the theme. *The Deal-- humor from the fact that Jerry and Elaine think they can HAVE SEX while keeping their friendship intact. *The Virgin-- Here's a show show where sex (or lack of it) is humorous! *The Raincoats-- A major sub-plot is Jerry attempting to make out with his girlfriend!

All these shows have sex as a main topic. No, they aren't EXACTLY like Elaine's foray with Puddy this season but then, if they were, they'd be recycling the same old plots.

Also, why is it that when Elaine has lots of sex, she's a slut, but Jerry can sleep with a new girl each week, and that's OK?

Lastly, I really think you're expecting too much. Like I've said before, history has shown that not every Seinfeld is going to be a 100% classic. Yet most have some aspect, be it a sub-plot, or a character, or a scene, that is memorable. Keep that in mind. Watch with an open mind, and you'll like it more...

Lance

Lance Allred wrote:

That's a good pick up line.

MsLiz [not available for picking up]

that's what elaines character is all about. "It's Vegetable lasagna. Vegetable Lasagna." That was so funny

Ohh boy, here we go with the religious mantra that someone always will inevitably spew everytime one conjures up the courage to demand QUALITY and ACCOUNTABILITY in a TV SHOW!!!!! As I pointed out clearly in my first post, the "Elaine Change" is simply very UNORIGINAL because practically every other show on TV has done it - the sexy clothes, the obbsesion to rake in cheap laughs with brainless sex jokes, the mean attitude, etc. We've all seen it done on TV this decade a million times, and yet before these last two seasons, Seinfeld had manged to keep from dropping to such low levels. This has nothing to do with religion or what not. It has to do with quality and simple sitcom physics. Yet, obviously, I'm about the only person here who cares about such things or even gives thought to such things. The best you guys can come up with is, "Ohh, it's just a TV show!" And you call yourselves "fans"? Sheesh. Your nothing more than puppets of the Cultural System.

Justin Tribble

[email] (John M Shuler) wrote:

Justin Tribble ([email]) wrote:

wow.

Now I'm fairly *certain* I'm being trolled, but I'm going along with it just the same. Shame on me.

Quality is far too subjective a topic to be able to address on common ground, I think. As for accountability.. what exactly should a friggin TV SHOW be accountable for? It's a *product*, buddy.

Sitcom physics?

You don't get out much, do you, Justin? If it's a lack of originality that you are bemoaning, then stick with it, don't give us bullshit about the physics of a sitcom. Newton could have cared less about how broadcasters cater to their audiences.

Wow, if this doesn't say "troll" all over it, I don't know what does.

yet.

I'll take the bait. Perhaps just because I feel contrary. :)

Yes, Justin. Some of us ARE able to be a fan of a show, and recognize the fact that "it's just a tv show". Believe it or not, the two are hardly mutually exclusive.

Now get off your couch and go throw a frisbee around with your dog, or go to a party with some friends. Seinfeld is Just. A. Television. Show.

shuler

How come every week Jerry or George has a new girlfriend and they talk about sex and such, that they are not put up to the same scrutiny as Elaine is.....Elaine sleeps around and she is a slut..George and Jerry do it..and they are men...??

Exactly!

Maria

Maria, not adding much:

So, is this what sexual equality has come to? It is just a matter of sinking to the lowest common denominator? Since one group can not keep standards on their behavior, the other group says fine we don't have to either. In fact, I don't even want to hear about it.

Both of you miss the point anyway. The original poster was remarking on a _change_ in the character "Elaine". Not on any one given time. Please put the soapboxes away, this whole scrutiny issue has been discussed "ad-nauseam".

LEGGGS wrote in message ... :It Shrinks...???

yup... :(

..j

Man it's the AIDS era, and these are professional mature people. Why do they have to have so many partners? And how in the hell does George manage to sleep with so many women? I have met guys who look better than him and are virgins into their late twenties.

Is it just the fact that it's a sitcom? Or is Jerry boffing all these girls under the age of 18? If this is Jerry's life its pretty sad. For such an obsessively clean man you'd think he'd be careful where he puts his sex organs.

Well just my thoughts. They don't have to sleep with EVERY person they date. Good god, it's not 1979.

James in Oklahoma City

Instead of attempting to find out, lash out. Truly the mark of a civilized person. :)

A "troll" is a person who delights in garnering attention on USENET by posting things that are deliberately inflammatory, regardless of whether or not the person agrees with them, for the sole reason of getting off on the fact that they can get attention.

Which is what I thought you were.

Now, I think you're just sad.

Don't take that personally.

I'm guessing Catholic school, overweight, not many friends, lives at home, awkward around women, and a lot of personal anger to work out at the world by building "up a force of other like-minded individuals who will challange the "status quo" of this newsgroup and defeat these puppets of the cultural elite and NWO barons. "

those words sound familiar?

Oh, and I'm not your pal, Twinkie.

I don't agree so much with this slut status thing, but I do think that Elaine is different this year: she's so lack-luster or something. She's not her usually spunky self, she's just caustic to me. I kind of miss the old Elaine.

Also has anyone noticed that when George's life is going fairly well-like he's employed maybe-Elaine's is falling apart. It' like they change places in terms of "loser-ness" occasionally.

The show could be better, if they didn't make Elaine into a slut.  Once
that happens, she will no longer attract some neat guys, that would fill
out her roll as the only gal in the show.   The storyline  is starting
to suffer from this type of writing. Even now, the only lines they give
this fine actress, could be accomplished by some bit player,        When
will the writers realize that they are starting to bore us. with remarks
about  sex...sex....sex....and little substance to the stories!    We'd
rather watch the shows that  were made 25 years ago....and were well
written with hints of sex....but  done  in a  tasteful and clever way.
This remark,doesn't just refer to this show..   Infact....it's still a
winner, among today's shows.   Ditto

Ditto.

[email] (Natalie Anton) wrote:

Y'know, those of us who are slaves to the corporate yadda yadda and still like the show may not have the discriminating taste you do, but I have to say that it's just out and out *stupid* to keep watching a show you now hate so much - then act all surprised and berate everyone else.

Taste is subjective, but sometimes stupid can be quantitatively defined.

Look, if you hate the show now, might I kindly suggest you are free to exercise your option to not watch it? Has it occurred to you that ceaselessly ranting about it might be (a) pointless, and (b) annoying to those who still enjoy watching? I like the show, and I don't feel I ought to have to defend that to you. If I didn't like your haircut, you'd tell me to *%$@ off - right? While you are certainly well within your rights to discuss Seinfeld's pluses and minuses until Kingdom Come (just as I am free to do about your hypothetical haircut), there is a point at which the discussion ceases to be useful, and nobody else wants to hear about it. "But Justin's haircut is *important* to me! But I haven't convinced everyone that he really needs a new 'do! But I just can't *stand* knowing that he has that haircut!". That theoretical obsession is *my* problem - and sooner or later you and everyone else is going to say "either shut up, or stop looking at his head" - and rightly so. Perhaps some of us feel the same about your never-ending discourse on how much Seinfeld now sucks.

"Doctor, it hurts when I do this" "Then don't do that".

Renee

<snip>

Has it occurred to YOU that people who are disappointed by this season (so far) may still be watching because they loved the previous seasons and they are hoping that the "Seinfeld of old" will return? Without watching it's kind of hard to know if it returns. Know what I mean? And, using your advice, if you don't like their posts, YOU are free to exercise YOUR option to not read them.

I don't buy into the "if you don't like it don't watch it" mantra, and I never have.

I'm a dedicated fan of Seinfeld - and I will continue to watch it even if I don't like it. And I will continue to post comprehensive studies of each new Seinfeld episode. This newsgroup needs a balance, and I provide that balance. If I weren't here pointing out all of the problems with the new episodes, then who would? You condense what I say into a tight package and exclaim that all my posts really amount to rants about how Seinfeld "sucks". In the end, that is exactly what I am doing, but I am doing it in a more complex fashion than you would lead us to believe. I write long, complex reviews of each episode - I don't just say, "Ohh, it sucks!"

I'm just providing a needed BALANCE.

Justin T.

RFerrie wrote:

Justin Tribble wrote in article ...

Sounds like you have a lot of spare time on your hands, Justie boy. Get a life for chrissakes....