Whoever posted my email address (which I leave as my *real* address
because I don't have any fears of "spam" or whatever you guys call it)
is very stupid. If you hadn't been so tied up in superficial affairs
with Dieyuppie, you would notice that I was posting here long before
Dieyuppie's AOL account was terminated. And the headers of past posts
would prove that, but ignorance seems to be a common quality among some
of the frequents of this newsgroup.
I repeat I am not Dieyuppie, however, he is a friend of mine. I'm
sure Yeahbuddy4 knows that already because we had a delightful online
chat. I've been more persecuted on usenet in one day than I have been
walking through the ghettos of downtown san diego all my life. Look
who's the real criminal here. I posted to alt.tv.southpark to stick up
for a friend who was being persecuted because his sense of humor was
misunderstood, but it seems many things are taken way too seriously here
on usenet, including south park. I'm sure the creators of south park
did not want people to take the cartoon as seriously as you guys do.
You idolize (or something close to the equivalent of) fictional
personalities like Eric Cartman, whose views and words mirror those of
Dieyuppie's, who is also a fictional personality might I add. Now are
the pieces of the puzzle fitting together?
I realize I will probably get persecuted more for what I have said
in this post, and I hope I haven't taken too much of your precious south
park space up. and I don't want to take up any more. So if you feel the
need to respond to this posting you may reply directly to the NG or feel
just as free to email me a response ([email]) Thank you.
I repeat I am not Dieyuppie, however, he is a friend of mine. I'm sure Yeahbuddy4 knows that already because we had a delightful online chat. I've been more persecuted on usenet in one day than I have been walking through the ghettos of downtown san diego all my life. Look who's the real criminal here. I posted to alt.tv.southpark to stick up for a friend who was being persecuted because his sense of humor was misunderstood, Your friend is an anti-semite who advocates violence openly on the usenet and engages in usenet abuse. If you think this is funny, perhaps you need to examine yourself a little deeper. As for idolizing Eric Cartman, I don't idolize anyone except maybe Ron Jeremy.
The captain is right of course you people take this show way too seriously all i was doing was taking the humor of south park to the next level but if yo people do not want to be witnesses to my comic genius then so be it
SassyPolar revealed his secret hobby when he wrote:
I was right, they DO all come from Carlsbad. Anyone who's friends with the dreaded Bare-Ass Allen is no friend of mine.
(On the other hand, concerning
I just have to say that anyone who makes a livingby fucking Letha Weapons six ways from Sunday AND GETS PAID FOR IT probably deserves a little idolization.)
On Sat, 13 Dec 1997 13:04:33 -0800, Captain Sensible offered this unto Shub-Internet:
I'll agree with you there. Ther eare very few people who post here that can read headers, hence the idiocy that ensues.
As for you posting here before the Nameless One, might I quote the article in question:
While you may not be the Nameless One, you sure do act a lot like him. At least you can spell and use the shift key.
Strictly speaking, no one is the criminal. Net.abuse isn't illegal, nor is flaming. Or providing phone numbers and adresses. Which I hope were inaccurate.
Perhaps my definition of humor is a bit old. I'd define humor as something funny, often witty but just as often idiotic. I see nothing humorous in:
Call me humorless, but I just don't find that funny. Can you perhaps explain the comedical value of that post?
There's a difference between taking a cartoon seriously and taking steps to eliminate an annoyance. If I sent you 20-30 emails a day saying 'Fuck you you Pinko-Commie bastard!', how would you react? Would you print them out to save the priceless humor contained within? I think not.
You mean that's not his real name? Wow. And all this time I had thought it was. Thanks for the clue, really.
There is a difference between a personality and a name, of course Dieyuppie isn't his real name, I assume a personality on usenet that I realize isn't quite accurate to my real life one. Because out there I don't have a keyboard and monitor to hide behind, I am much different in real life, and so is Dieyuppie, and I'm pretty sure you and everyone else in this usenet group is too. But, really I shouldn't have to explain such elementary concepts to you, my own theory is that your ego blocked you from seeing this while you were writing that response, yeah and that same ego will also deny it, and dag nabbit, I could be completely wrong. But that's for you to know and no one else to find out because the internet gives us such great anonymity, which is why it's so damn harsh out here. Because everyone realizes that they can step on all the harmless little ants that they want to, knowing that they're safe, secure and anonymous, and the power button to their computer always lies safely within grasp. I am just as guilty of this as all of you reading this post. The internet gives us sort of an impure form of anarchy and we abuse it, just like the man who abuses his wife and kids because his mental walls prevent him from seeing how much he really DOES have. I know I am hypocritical in saying this, because you may be thinking, what exactly have I done to prevent this degradation of a potential paradise, absolutely nothing, I have only provoked it. But I will admit my wrongs, and the least you could do is at least think about what I have said, and the most you could do is work with me in tearing down our mental walls and barriers, and shattering the glass of anonymity. Thank you
Been watching a little too much Full Metal Jacket, have we?? Hmm??
A little homophobic, too.
Grow up. Learn that calling someone gay isn't an intelligent insult. It makes you look like a backwards rednecked buffoon.
And on top of that, you're just plain ugly. ;>
Hehehe.
----
... When one door closes, another opens. But we often look so regretfully
upon the closed door that we don't see the one that has been opened
for us ... -- alexander graham bell --
on the contrary...didnt sound homophobic to me at all...
In fact, requesting the reach around sounded like courtesy and promotion of that alternative lifestyle.
At no point in time was the "implied" anal sex depicted derrogatorily...it could have even served to be heterosexual, especially if the pitcher was wearing any hardware...
On Sun, 14 Dec 1997 01:06:34 -0800, Captain Sensible offered this unto Shub-Internet:
Dammit, I had a good, searing retort building but as I read the posts responding to this one, I can almost sympathize. Anyway, onto the response.
I must say that I thought you had the two mixed up. For the record, I'm a very different pererson in person <boy that sounds weird> only because I can't express myself in the same way with the same impact in person as I can in Usenet or wherever. I could get into the stereotypes associated with being 6'4" 250 lbs., but this is neither the time nor the place. Suffice to say I had you pegged as someone who was less intelligent than this post has revealed.
I don't see how we abuse this 'impure form of anarchy'. Perhaps we are taking to long to organize ourselves? There are groups who do have order, but the majority are still chaotic. If the previous made absolutely no sense, you're not going crazy. It all goes back to my theory about anarachy, namely that it's merely a transition stage. The same goes for libertarianism <the party to which I owe my alligance, FWIW>. But this isn't the place for such discussions.
I'm glad that you recognize your hypocrisy, but I'm afraid I shall have to retain my veil, likely for the same reasons that you do. Namely, there are likely people in this group who would love to send me all sorts of junk mail or calls or whatever and I don't particularly want that. In a more private forum, sure, but Usenet has too much of that pyscho user base for me.
I will, however, reveal as much of myself as I can while still keeping myself safe from said pyschos. Of course, I could just be lying, but I guess you'll have to decide how much to trust me on your own. My name is Adam. My last name is rather unique, and I'm the only one listed in the phone book under it. Beyond my parents, of course. I'm 17, a senior at Chantilly High School in Northern Virigina. I slack way too much, listen to mainly heavy metal but there's a little of everything in my collection. AS previously stated, I'm 6'4", about 250 lbs., short brown hair, size 13 boot. Always boots for me, steel toed. I read tons. Everything from Robert Jordan <fantasy> to Homer <not Simpson, the other one> to Nietzsche. I live at my computer, love movies, hockey, football <go Skins!> and baseball <go Braves!>. I have something like a .8 GPA, no job, no car, no license, not even a drivers permit. I love porn, can't get enough. But then again, who can? I'm known by many other names, Bob <obviously>, Charlie, Manson, Happy Knee and my favorite, slacker. I loathe school, math in particular. Christianity is a sham, Taoism is the way <and the Way> to go, Republicans bite but not nearly as hard as Democrats. Freud was too obssesd with sex for his own good. The native Americans deserve everything they got, as do all the slaves brought over and anyone else currently in slavery/being re/oppresed. H.P. Lovecraft is a god, Robert Jordan weaves a tale like no other, Metallica has sold out but their old stuff still rocks. I have no direction and so will likely be attending community college next year, but my future doesn't really matter as the world will be ending shortly. Reality is in the eye of the beholder. The Romans are nothing but 2 bit hacks when it comes to their mythology. Leno sucks, Letterman sucks less, Conan rocks. Everyone is, at least a little bit, racist, sexist & gay. I shoplift to excess, mainly books that are too damned expensive. I play D&D and enjoy it. That's pretty much me in a nutshell. Take it or leave it, it's the truth.
I also think you side stepped my main point, which was that what the Nameless One posts isn't humorous. Most of his posts are irrelevant, hard to read, pointless and down right stupid. Not to mention often posted twice. Add to that the many, many posts he makes each day, most of which consist of 1 line of acutal post and 2 lines of sig. He has nothing to say and I prefer not to read his babble. There are groups specifically for mindless babble <most of alt.fan.* comes to mind> so it's not like he has nowhere to vent. I'm not saying that he shouldn't be able to spew what he spews, but this isn't the place. If he wants to find out stuff about South Park, he can lurk. I'm sure there are tons of people who lurk in this group, likely out numbering the posters 3 or 4 to 1, if other groups are any indication. If he has something to say about South Park that he hasn't said to excess already, he can and should post it. Even the odd off-topic thread is fine, but his signal to noise ratio has to be almost as bad as the alt.sex.* hierarchy. In short, I don't like him and if I had a killfile he'd be at the top of the list.
i damn near fit your description to the T but i get better grades and im only 6' and 175 lbs
but most importantly i read the entire post and i have to say i am more than impressed (people think that a low GPA is a sign of stupidity but that very often is quite the contrary in my school)
im glad to see that im not the only "loser" out there whatever it might be defined as
I think that's true in most schools, at least it is in my area as well as yours.. I *was* a 4.0 student when I was very young.. We had annual tests (CHSPE or something?) and I always got within the 90 percentile, but they never put me into honors classes.. I ended up tutoring other kids in my class, doing the teachers' work for them.. Until I got old enough to realize I should just slack off.. Then I dropped out of that shitty high school and taught myself through independant study.. Worked out much better, although now I don't want to go to college because I hate the "classroom atmosphere".. *sigh*
Fortunately, all that time slacking was "well-spent" as I was running a BBS that took up most of my time and am now working for an online service because of it :)
...you can achieve you goals.. i'm living proof.. beefcake.. BEEFCAKE!!
On 17 Dec 1997 23:41:21 GMT, [email] offered this unto Shub-Internet:
It always seems to work out that way, doesn't it? I got put into honors type classes and did fine in them until 9th grade or so, when I decided I'd rather spend my time pursuing my own interests instead of someone else's. I'd do that now if I thought I would have any sucess at it. Unfortunately, I want a PHD someday, and for that I need a high school diploma. So I'm stuck for another 7 months or so taking science that I'll never use and government tha I could care less about, even if it is interesting at times.
My biggest disappointment this year has been my pyschology class. It's something I'm genuinely interested in, and the class is pure slack. Not that I don't like slack classes, but I would have acutally liked to have learned something. Alas, it was not to be, so I read Jung and Freud in class while the latest Disney release is playing.
Really? I've always wondered how people got into working for ISPs, especially news admins, as I'd enjoy that.
You too?!?! I mean, what the hell is the deal with this? Is this like a nation-wide policy? The psychology (sp?) class I take in my school (I'm in 12th grade) is ultra-slack. Examples:
1.) "Class, we've been talking about the eye and the mind lately. To
illustrate the points of how
easily they can be fooled, we're watching something I taped off
FOX last night: Magic's Greatest
Secrets Revealed!"
2.) "Lately, we've been talking about REM sleep, and dreams. So, for
the rest of the class, we're going to go to sleep. If you can
have a dream and remember it, then you earn a stamp for the
day." [The way the class works is: 40% classwork (of which
we rarely have, and when we do have
it, it's easy), 30% end of 9 weeks test (that's right, only 1 test
a quarter), and 30% classwork.
For classwork, we have this little sheet of 30 squares. Anytime
you say something in class, or
do an assignment in class, you get a stamp. 30 stamps =
100% of 30% of your grade = 30 points of
your final grade] He _made_ us go to sleep! This is not a joke!
3.) A question off our end-of-semester test last week:
Which of the following does not belong?
A.) Pituitary gland
B.) Sex gland
C.) Endocrine glands/system
D.) Lungs
Lungs. LUNGS!!! My God, what's wrong with our schools? And if you think I'm joking, let me tell you; I'm not.
Call up a local ISP. Hell, I'm only 16, and the sysadmin of my local ISP told me to fax them a resume, and they'd keep it handy when they had a job opening. It's not exactly a job offer, but at least you know they're not opposed to the idea. Remember: People with computer skills are _always_ in demand.
On Sat, 20 Dec 1997 22:55:43 -0500, Pegasus offered this unto Shub-Internet:
I think it is a nation-wide policy. Maybe it's Clinton's new War on Education bill or something.
Hey! That was a good show. I especially liked the assitants. But I digress.
I've got you beat. After my teacher finished telling us about how you don't dream until 90 minutes have elapsed since you fell asleep, she had us sleep for 10, _ten_, minutes and tell her what we dreamed. She actually expected us to dream, this wasn't a trick question type deal.
We have to turn in a notebook 2-3 times each quarter. It's something like 25% of our grade. Not only does she have students grade them, she just looks at what the grade is and writes it in her book. The girl I sit next to has never even turned one in and has always gotten 100's on them. My teacher has fallen asleep in class, shows us this old 80's PBS series 'Degrassi High' that has no pyschological meaning whatsoever, shows us the same videos a few times and never seems to notice that everyone works together on the tests. We're not even coy about it anymore. I've seriously been having a conversation with her, asked her to stop a moment, gotten someone else's scantron, copied the answers and then continued on with the conversation.
And what's the deal with scantrons? If it's a 200 question test in a mandatory class, I can see using them. Not for a 15 question test in an elective.
Isn't it sick? I've never had anything that obvious, but I've had some pretty idiotic ones.
Yeah, but what does your resume look like? I'm not really the ultra-super-pyscho computer type. There are guys in my school who can program Web browsers. Freshmen can do this. I don't have that kind of skill, I'm more of a Usenet freak. But I doubt that posting to Usenet is going to get you a job at an ISP. In one class period, mind you.
Oh, I'm not saying it was a good show. I'll be one of the first to say it was cool. But, to use it as a teaching tool? That's blurring the line just a tad, don't you think?
Got you beat there.. my physics teacher picks up our notebook (still closed, mind you), thinks for a second, and says, "Hmm. It feels heavy enough. You get a 100." Keep in mind, this is not just our physics notebook, most students have all their subjects in one notebook. For all she knows, the damn few physics papers we have might not even be in the notebook!
I'm a bit ambivalent as to whether I should pity or envy you.
I just don't like them because they're a fucking pain in the ass with those stupid rectangles. I never seem to fill those in quite right.. I mean, the bubbles, they were easy. These rectangles are a pain in the damn ass!
Sick doesn't even describe it.
<nod, nod> I know kids who set aside a week to try and figure out how to program Doom. And then do it.
I doubt it, too. Sooner or later, you'll be able to get in the industry. Once you get in, piece of cake, after that it's all experience and learning. The hard part is getting your foot in the door.
On Tue, 23 Dec 1997 01:26:58 -0500, Pegasus offered this unto Shub-Internet:
Just a bit. You have to look on the bright side, though. It could have been something bad you had to watch.
It really makes you wonder who's handing out the teaching degrees.
I enjoy it. It's not like I couldn't pass the tests with flying colors on my own, they're all super-easy questions. Doing it that way just makes things go faster. We rotate who does the work every test, it's really an efficent system.
<snip>
I can't believe that they'll really take someone on with a minimum of knowledge and experience and teach them from there. I guess I should actually look into it more, see what kinds of positions a typical ISP has and things like that. I don't want to lick envelopes and send out disks to new users, after all.
Do you know how to help people set up software? If you do, you could get a position answering phones/tech help. You're right, I don't think they'd take anyone with a minimum of knowledge, but I'm sure you could get a job showing you had some experience, expertise, and a desire to learn more.
I don't mean to be mean or anything, but you're really not in a position with lots of leverage, are you? When you're just out of school and need to make rent for that month, you'll realize pretty quick that beggars can't be choosers.
On Wed, 24 Dec 1997 01:29:02 -0500, Pegasus offered this unto Shub-Internet:
<snip>
I hadn't thought of that. I'd probably have to acutal get a computer with Windoze 95 so I'd know what most people were working from, though.
Yeah, but if I'm going to work for an ISP I want to be doing something with computers, not doing some lackey job. If I wanted to lick envelopes I'd work for a political campaign.
Or install Linux or FreeBSD, and you're much better off at getting into the field. A UNIX background gets you much farther than being able to troubleshoot Win95.
Anyone can troubleshoot Win95. Just reboot. Then reinstall. Repeat until A) it works, or B) you say "fuckit" and reformat your drive.
Yeah, that's a good idea. Let's start an OS jihad on this group. Fucking brilliant. <G>
FTR, I've worked very closely with technical placement agents and I can uncategorically assure you that Win32 techs are _much_ more in demand than UNIX ones and also get paid US$15-20K more a year.
This post hasn't hit my server yet, so I'll reply here. The References: header will be gefuct, but oh well.
They'd have to pay me US$15-20K more a year to spend my time working with Windows crapware.
The majority of "Win32 techs" I know are the kind of people who go home and never turn on their computers. Compare this with just about 100% of the "UNIX techs" <snicker> I know, who instead love what they are doing, and contribute to things such as free software, and OS development.
See, we do it because it's fun, and it's what we love. We don't *need* to "get paid US$15-20K more a year" to convince us to do it.
I'd like to see a "Win32 tech" with HALF the dedication and enjoyment in what s/he's doing as that of a UN*X devotee. Not to mention knowledge of how their machine works.
But I didn't post my previous article to start an "OS jihad". It was a suggestion on how best to have an net-related job. Tech-support will drive you crazy. Read alt.tech-support.recovery some time. But being a sysadmin of a UN*X box, and being PAID for it? That's a DAMN cool thing, if I do say so myself.
Followups set. My turn to apologize to Eli.
Win32 being NT4 and Win95. 32-bit (somewhat), as compared to 3.x and previous versions.
Actually, if you're looking for an entrey level tech position, knowing Win95 and Mac will get you far. Knowing unix get you...ummm...a pat on the back. No home users use unix. If you're looking for a sysadmin job on the other hand, unix is the way to go. Its all what you're looking for.
On 29 Dec 1997 03:34:05 GMT, [email] (Thomas Hughes) offered this unto Shub-Internet:
I'd like to be a newsadmin, but doubt I could get there in one easy jump. I'd also probably run Unix on this cmputer if I ever got another one. Since that won't be happening before hell freezes over, and since I'd most likely have an entry level position, I'll probably just stick with Win95 <which I got for Christmas> and do Unix after I get started.
On 17 Dec 1997 23:11:09 GMT, "Frank Rizzo" offered this unto Shub-Internet:
Impressed how?
Half the people with low GPAs at my school are smarter than the people with the 4.0s. They can snicker at me for going to a community college and doing what I enjoy. I'll snicker at them for working their asses off and becoming bitter because they wasted this time.
I find it rather disheartening that I'm likely to be termed such because I'd rather expand my mind than waste my time at the mall. It should be interesting to see where everyone is in 10 years. Very interesting.
Don't ever let anyone tell you that GPA and intelligence are related. [Hey! A Spirit of Christmas clip just came on the radio! Hot damn! Okay, sorry.] I could name you people that are dumb as fucking posts, yet have 4.2 GPAs. And there are alot of these people in my school; they don't just exemplify vapidity, they fucking define it.
I wouldn't be quick to label people bitter just for working their asses off, and 'wasting their time'. Case in point: me. I have worked my ass off in high school, and I'm not going to go into a job where I'm not happy. Want to know how I'll do that? Because if I graduate with semi-decent grades from the college I want to go to, then dammit, I will not have to tear my hair out for a job.. just a simple fact, not a brag. If I'm not happy in a job, I'll leave, simple as that. The rent and car insurance will get paid somehow, I'll find a way.. I'm not going to sacrifice my happiness just for the love of money. I'll be doing something I love, I'll be happy, and I'll be putting food on the table for my family. I will not have 'wasted my time.' Yes, I don't like calculus, and I probably won't use it all that much, but it will not be a 'waste of my time.' Because of that 'waste of time', it might make me look like a better candidate to a better college of my choice, which is ultimately a positive thing. And let me point out something: you know all the stuff you want to know, and didn't 'waste your time' learning everything else in school. Other people 'waste their time' in school, but become more well-rounded people, developing a foundation of knowledge based on various things instead of one field of knowledge. And you think you're justified in laughing at these people? Yeah, right.
Don't find it disheartening; fuck those other people, fuck their preconceptions; fuck what they think. I'm probably called a loser because I play Magic: The Gathering and I'm festively plump. Who gives a shit? I'm happy. Fuck those other people whose lives are so vacant and unfulfilled that they have to waste their time analyzing mine.
Yea sorry dude you are a loser if you play magic the gathering i mean i played it and im sure a lot of people have but it got boring after about 5 minutes and now only losers still play it so therefore you are a loser poker is for money i am cool
On Sat, 20 Dec 1997 23:17:33 -0500, Pegasus offered this unto Shub-Internet:
I don't, but an amazing number of people do.
<snip>
I'll admit that I go for a more 'classical' education, focusing mainly on literature, but I by no means limit myself to one field. The vast majority of people at my school who spend tons of time doing homework know absolutely nothing. You could ask them something about George Washington Carver and they'd say 'Wasn't he the first president?' or who think the War of 1812 was after the Civil War or before the War of Independence.
<snip>
There's nothing wrong with being festively plump, I'm a member of the tall and fat club myself. Magic, however.....
On Tue, 23 Dec 1997 01:19:54 -0500, Pegasus offered this unto Shub-Internet:
I speak from experience. That game sucks money like nothing ever has. At one point, I was actually going to my freind's houses and looking under the cushions on their sofas for change to buuy booster packs. It's a sickness. People can talk about how they only spend 10 bucks a month on it and they do fine, but it doesn't work. You can have all the talent in the world and still loses to someone who has all the right cards and a spoonfull of brains. I had a good time, sure, but at what a cost.
I have to agree, despite liking the game. The thing is a moneypit, bar none.
Now that's just twisted.
Good point. But, there is a trick.. it took 3 years, but I learned how to make a killer deck that doesn't break the bank. Totally made out of commons, uncommons, and the few rares it has I traded for them. There is only one exception in the 2 decks I have like that, and that's a Serra Angel that I bought for $4.00. I couldn't find anyone willing to trade her, so I just got fed up and bought her at a local comic store. But other than that, my decks are built from trades and boosters. And after I got my decks built, I never bought another pack.. I mean, the way they release expansions, who the hell can keep up? So why even try?
On Wed, 24 Dec 1997 01:34:00 -0500, Pegasus offered this unto Shub-Internet:
<snip>
Your deck may work fine now, but people will come up with defenses against it. That's the worst part, you constantly have to adapt. Assuming you play by tournament rules, you'll also have to change your deck every time a new expansion comes out since you won't be able to use stuff from previous ones. Is it just me, or is that incredibly twisted? They put out cards, everyone gets them, then you can't use them. New players start and they won't play you if you're using those cards, so they just sit there like trophies.
On Wed, 24 Dec 1997 01:34:00 -0500, Pegasus wrote:
I've never played Magic, but I was an avid Dungeons and Dragons afficianado way back in my pimply virginal high school years.
D&D sucked money like nothing I've ever been involved in, with the exception of computer paraphenalia. Just when you had all the AD&D books on hand--and getting hold of the Fiend Folio just so you could have the stats on Githyanki Knights was like pulling toenails, let me tell you--TSR goes and makes a 2ND EDITION RULES set. New books, different format, and some Trapper Keeper for you to put all your well-read and colored Monster Manual info in. Oh, it's only about 50 bucks to get the upgrade (gee, that sounds familiar), but it destroys all the hard work you did memorizing everything about the old rules.
Then we have all the "handbooks." Priests, wizards, clerics, etc., all with nice little ten dollar manuals on how to play the characters.
I've since left this era behind, but I can see how role-playing games force you to read more into it and spend more money on the latest tomes to beef up your knowledge or playing ability.
Plus the fact that the group you dungeon with influences greatly how you play. Get some whiney asshole who has a pristine character, kill it off, and you become the bad guy. Great game for it's time, but I've moved on to the new role-playing adventure: USENET.
Again, an off-topic post for a.t.spark, but I had to put in my two Triganic Pu's.
On Tue, 30 Dec 1997 17:20:56 GMT, [email] (Tracer Bullet) offered this unto Shub-Internet:
<snip>
Imagine the amount you spent on D&D stuff x 10. That's how much money Magic guzzles. I know, I've been on both sides. Still on one side, in fact, but more on that a bit later.
Ah, but were Githyanki Knights essential to your campaign? This may sound hypocritical after all my ranting on Magic, but I only get what interests me. They put out a set of books with a different way to create characters. I picked one up and flipped through it, liked what I saw and got the rest. OTOH, I see tons of people with the Tome of Magic so I flip through it, don't like it and leave it. That'll change, unfourtunately, since I'm thinking about playing a mage.
So just stick with 1st edition. There are a lot of people outthere who still play 1st edition, some simply because Gygax did it but most for the reasons you described: they didn't want ot shell out again for stuff they already had. Not that I blame them. If, or perhaps when now that Wizards of the Coats<the guys who make Magic> owns TSR, there is a 3rd edition, I'll probably get the PHB and go from there. If it's completely different and I don't like the changes, I'll stick with 2nd edition. FWIW, you can run most any 2nd edition module under 1st edition with minimum modifications.
Again, I only get them if I'm interested. I got the Elf book the minute I saw it, but still haven't gotten the psionics book, even though psionics are used in our campaign.
You don't have to beef up your knowledge, your DM should tell you all you need to know. If you're a DM, don't use it. If the players want it so bad, have them buy the book. There are tons of people who are still using the 1st edition rules and are perfectly happy.
That's a problem with the people you play with, not the game itself. I'm sure you had a character that you loved, how would you feel if she/he/it died? If you could say 'Screw it, it's just a game' then good, but the people who can't are the ones who shouldn't be playing in the first place. Those are the kind who kill their parents and run around getting lost in sewers.
Ah yes, the great opportunity known as Usenet. I've half a mind to start off on a career as a troll, I think it'd be a lot of fun.
On Wed, 31 Dec 1997 03:05:53 GMT, [email] (Bob the Soul Crusher) wrote:
Well, Githyanki Knights were not essential to my campaign, but the Fiend Folio just had a lot of cool monsters in it. And yes, I understand the purpose of getting only the books that you want, but often--as in computers--you want it all. Yesterday.
True, we continued with 1st edition rules, but all the new stuff was coming out 2nd ed. We never tried running modules from 2nd ed. with 1st ed. rules. I'm sure it would be easy enough, though.
I agree, if you are partial to certain characters, or fighting methods (I think there is even a book on siege and war campaigns), it is good to get the book. One thing I missed was that the very first ed. of Deities and Demigods had the Melnibonean (Michael Moorcock's Elric character), Cthulu and Fritz Lieber Mythos (Fafhrd and the Grey Mouser). These disappeared from later editions (due to what I'm sure is copyright infringement). Although it may have been difficult including them in the campaign, the artistry was awesome. A paen for the old days (sniff).
Oh, I agree. My friends simply bought the books because they wanted the info--and, as a former DM, to make my life a living hell trying to be ingenious and slip one past them--and the fact that "if you didn't have all the books, you weren't shit (remember, high school mentality).
True, it was not a problem with the game, but it was a definite problem with the people I played with, even from two different gaming groups. We never had someone on the fringe of reality, wanting to do ritualistic sacrifices or anything, but sometimes they went ballistic when you killed off their character (oops, you failed your saving throw--the green slime just killed you...no cleric in the party, either).
If my quote sounded like a troll in the Usenet definition, it wasn't meant to be. Being a troll in the D&D sense may be fun, but I'm sure it would be hard getting chicks.
On Wed, 31 Dec 1997 13:43:26 GMT, [email] (Tracer Bullet) offered this unto Shub-Internet:
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That is the great curse of the truely interesting, to want it all even though you know you'll never be able to keep up. I've got about 20 books I want to read, actually own them not just a list, and what do I ask for for Christmas? Yup, more books.
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They even have boks on running a campaign in Homer's Greece, complete with Odysseus and Perseus running around.
Ah, Deities and Demigods. I've heard many good things about that. I wish I had gotten it, but I probably would have been about 1-2 when it came out, but it still would have been good to get, if onyl for future use.
Hmmm, I'm still in high school for another 5 months, but have never had that mentality. As for trying to slip stuff past the DM, that's part of the fun. I remember when I made a drow with the new rules that had subabilities that allow you to raise a score by two points for some bonuses if you lower it by two for others. First fight, I go charging in with a long sword, something like +4 to hit and the same for damage and a -5 to AC for extremly high dexterity. When I needed a 7 to hit, being first level, and had a negative AC the DM finally decided to look through the books a bit more carefully. The drow only lasted that one fight before the DM smote him with a meteor to restore game balance, but the look on his face was priceless.
Two different groups? Maybe you just attract that kind of group.
Ah, so there _is_ another party that didn't include a cleric. I thought my party was the only one. Rather odd since it's a very combat intensive campaign, but we've got a good deal of healing stuff.
No no no. I meant trolls look like they have a lot of fun. I could go to rec.games.frp.dnd and start telling everyone how they were going to hell for playing such awful devil-worshipping games and keep a half decent arguement going for a while. I didn't mean that your post looked like a troll, just that it would be fun to piss tons of people off and stick by your position for a long time.
Sorry to jump in the middle here, but this discussion caught my eye...
[email] (Bob the Soul Crusher) writes:
I was the same way for a while, until my wallet started suffering badly. I then just devoted my time to further developing the world I had created in my early days of gaming. I now have two bankers boxes full of stuff that IMO is much better than the heavily overrated Forgotten Realms campaign. The Beauty of D&D is that all you really need are the basic rules and dice.
Ewe! That sounds downright horrible! I didn't like when they began introducing middle eastern campaigns, and then far eastern, and so on and so forth. To me that makes it a whole different game, and doesn't really belong under the moniker of D&D.
I still have my copy from years ago. I hear that it's worth a few bucks these days. True?
He he he...my players were never really able to get that type of thing over on me. I was always pretty well versed in the rules, and generally knew much much more than they did. Of course, we would often slide from the rules. One of the most fun things about DMing was making up rules on the fly for those awkward situations.
No group that I was in nor that I ran had a cleric, save one. Actually, thieves were always the most popular in my circles. We would often have lengthy campaigns of just city orientated material, with all types of mystery and a big interwoved plotline that would run on for months on end. I was good for that sort of thing...
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On 31 Dec 1997 21:05:46 GMT, [email] (Shoegaze99) offered this unto Shub-Internet:
I think I was a bit vague. I didn't get any D&D books for Christmas, I got real books. Shakespeare, Lovecraft, Milton and some mythology. Not that I didn't ask for D&D stuff, I always do but never seem to get any. As for Forgotten Realms, I've just gotten started on it and am rather impressed by the sheer size of it. I may be a bit ill informed, though, as Ravenloft is the only other campaign I've acutally sat down and read.
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To each his own, I guess. I've never had much desire to play a campaign in a non-medieval setting, but I guess some people like ninjas crawling around everywhere. I do like the katana, though.
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Probably. I'd probably grab one if I saw it on a shelf somewhere, but I'm not going to track it down or anything. There are those that would, however. You just have to find them. Assuming you want to sell, that is.
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I have no doubt that I know more about the game than my DM does. I'd DM if my group liked a bit of roleplaying. As it is, we have a _very_ combat intensive campaign. Not that that's a bad thing, most of us are relatively new to the game and haven't had a chance to work a character much past 3-4 level, but I kinda want more substance. That and all the world jumping we do is very confusing. I go out and kill 3 evil wizards, save an elven kingdom from a horde of broken ones and clean out a den of drow and then wind up in Dark Sun where nobody knows who I am _and__ elves are mistrusted. So we go off and do the adventure that comes with the box, a 6th level group doing an introductory adventure and then the main villan gets away because nobody thinks to use the bone dagger we picked up. Then we go back to the previous world, but in a completely different place, which is where we are currently. Unless we happen to be in Ravenloft or Forgotten Realms next time.
Well, that got a bit away, but what I was trying to say is I have a lot more time and inclination to read new rules and make adventures than the current DM does, but the other players attacked 5,000 gnolls while the gnolls were summoning a demon. Then they attacked a guy (8th level evil cleric> riding a red dragon. They don't seem to understand he concept of setting up a plot. Perhaps I should have got them all a book for Christmas.
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Ah, plot, how I long for thee! Our current party is: 3 fighters, one of which doesn't play much and a mage who also doesn't play much. So it's mainly me and another guy, slogging through the caverns of the monster of the month. Not that it's not entertaining at times, but when you've got a 6th level fighter and a 1st level fighter going up against the same monsters, someone's not going to be too happy. Since something that would give me a challenge would eat teh ther guy for breakfast, I'm generally stuck in endless hordes of kobolds and gnolls. Those hordes _have_ brought me up to 8th level, so I guess I can't complain too much.
Ahhh, even better! *Real* books! Very good, carry on...
Oh, wait. Incidentally, I'm not surprised about your reaction towards the size of the Forgotten Realms. Ten years ago it was huge, and when I see the amount of products out now it just makes me ill. To me that ruins everything that is fun about the game. I mean, a basic layout to build a world around is cool, but the FR does everything for you...it's like paint by numbers.
My feelings exactly. Non-medieval settings are nice to hint at in your campaign in order to add a hint of foriegn mystery, but I'd never actually want to adventure in one...it just wouldn't feel right.
Argh! Sounds like my early days of playing. Nothing but random dungeosn and fights, world hopping and battles. It was downright silly. It was fun at first, but you really start to long for more, you know? That's when I took over as DM...
Man, anybody who plays D&D should read The Lord of Rings so they understand what it is all about.
Ahhh, plot is my forte. In fact, we have actually had full evening adventures with little or no combat. (it's rare, but sometimes it has happened) I've actually been able to write short novels on the adventures that I have led people on.
The most recent (about a year and a half ago...the last time I played) involved a group of shadowy figures who were trying to work a coup in an island city. In the midst of gaining some intelligence info, they accidentally pulled my players into their scheme, though the players didn't know what they were involved in. Every session resulted in bits and pieces being revealed, but the truth was constantly changing in their eyes. After a number of adventures in a series of caverns that they were locked in (tricked into by the evil group), including assisting in a war between two goblin clans, they emerged to find themself under the towering citadel that overlooked the very island city that was in danger...and it was in chaos.
Of course, they had no idea that this was the plan, so they had to spend a few days avoiding mutilation in a city burst into chaos, and so on. This was one part in a three part climax which we unfortunately never reached. The getting there was fun though. One guy was trying to play boths sides, because he held some vital info to all of the several factions involved. At one point, he sold out his friends, who were the victims of an assassination attempt in a tavern. He met with the leaders of the evil dudes that same evening, tried to bribe them, found himself over his head, and had to beat a retreat. We had a *great* escape scene, where he finally got out of the building and was led to the dockside by yet another group. A midnight canoe chase across a huge, foggy lake ensued, with arrows flying in the dark, and blah blah blah...
I can't really go on too much more, becuase the story actually takes up pages and pages. If you want to pick this up via e-mail, let me know. We'll take this out of the NG, and I'll share some of my better plots and stuff with you for you use.
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Hey bob did i send you 20 emails saying die you pinko commie bastard no but i should of and what do you mean im funny am i a clown am i supposed to amuse you