Simpsons Symposium with the Canadian OFF Writers Feb. 13th - a review

Feb 14, 2002, 12:25 AM ET21 posts by 8 posters
21 posts
Daniel Dreibelbis

Just got back from tonight's symposium in Toronto on The Simpsons, featuring OFF co-executive producer Tim Long and and co-producer Joel Cohen, and moderated by _This Hour Has 22 Minutes_/_Whose Line Is It Anyway?_ actor Colin Mochrie, For the most part, an entertaining and informative evening behind the phenomenon which is OFF.

They started by showing "Behind The Laughter" on the screen at the Isabel Bader Theatre. This was actually pretty neat seeing OFF on a theatre screen and with a stereo soundtrack in a darkened theatre, and there was quite a bit of uproarious laughter at this classic, it was almost as if most of the audience hadn't seen this episode!

Colin, Joel and Tim then sat onstage and talked about what it was like for Canadians to work in the US, about working with such a well-established show, and behind the scenes stuff regarding the writing. Colin, known for his rapid-fire zanyness on the shows he works on, was remarkably subdued tonight, he seemed very much in awe about talking about OFF (he revealed that at _This Hour Has 22 Minutes_ they have a large poster of OFF in the writing room, and it is not uncommon for the cast and writers to suddenly go off into a Simpsons routine). Joel and Tim, in between chugging bottles of water, gave insight and witty asides about their careers and writing for OFF.

Among the revelations:

- Tim revealed that yes, Nestle was very cheesed off about the "Butterfingers Being Burned" scene in "Sweets And Sour Marge", and that the blackboard gag at the beginning of "Half-Decent Proposal" was the writers' way of making penance for that joke.

- the writers actually make a game of putting things in the scripts to see what the Fox censor takes out, and what the censor misses. Among the ones that got past that surprised them - the "glory hole" reference in "Night Of The Dolphin" (THOH XI), and Grampa's "Oval Office" remark to Amber in "Brawl In The Family". (Tim said that when they got the script back for "Brawl", that the censor had put the words "nice one!" next to that joke)

- alt.tv.simpsons was mentioned! Regarding the Internet, Joel said that they are aware that they do have fans critical of the show online, but that doesn't bother the writers too much, because for every "Worst Episode Ever!" there's a "No Way, That Episode Rocked!" Joel also said that he had found out that day that someone in New Zealand had put together a web site personally attacking him for the show's supposed "downfall", which he found funny and a little sad.

They then broke a bit by showing a test reel from the first act of "Behind The Laughter" in which rough pencil animation was superimposed over the soundtrack for the animators to follow - and yes, Julie Kavner actually does say the word that's bleeped (it's only partially bleeped in the test reel, but it's still obvious).

After a half hour of this, the microphones were brought out and the questions were asked by the audience. Among them:

- "is the recent improvement on the Simpsons the result of the cutting humour of _Family Guy_?" (this brought groans from the audience). Joel: "you mean the recently cancelled _Family Guy_?" (cheers from audience). Later, Joel would say that _Family Guy_, though a nice try, didn't quite work because it was all rapid-fire gags and was missing something that made the Simpsons tick - heart.

- one guy had the balls to try to hand a fanscript to Joel. Joel quickly grabbed it, peeked at the first page and dropped it at his feet. He then said "that's a nice try - and it's only going to work once tonight!" He would then re-iterate that any scripts, even spec scripts, really should be done through proper channels with an agent.

- What sort of control does Matt Groening have with the show? Tim said that though Matt "doesn't have as much control over the Simpsons as you might think", he does still come to the writers and gives suggestions and plot ideas from time to time.

- Are there any rules you have to follow with characters? Tim said that they do have two rules regarding Homer: one, Homer can't be dumber than a dog, and two, Homer can't forget his own name. He then said that, "over the years, we've had to modify the first rule a bit by changing the breed of dog - when we started, Homer couldn't be dumber than a German Shephard, and about now he can't be dumber than a Dalmatian".

- there was a question regarding the impact of September 11th and how it has impacted the writers, and if there were any gags that they regretted doing prior to the tragedy. "New Kids On The Blecch's" missile attack on Mad Magazine was mentioned by the questioner. Joel said that that gag really did affect him after the attacks happened, and he also revealed that there had been talk about actually releasing that episode as a special promotional DVD in America due to the N*SYNC appearance, which were promptly quashed because of September 11th. One revelation of a gag that was pulled before airing from a recent episode: in "She Of Little Faith", there was a bit regarding Homer's rocket destroying the church, in which Chief Wiggum found the initials "HJS" on the rocket, and was immediately placing under arrest his prime suspect, one Hassan Jafar Salaam. The gag was written before Sept. 11th, and was quickly excised.

- "Any ideas you haven't used?" - Joel mentions that ideas are often scribbled down and tacked to a corkboard in the writers' room, and they stay there until they're either used or turn yellow and fall off. He mentions that the oldest idea still on the board is one about Homer visiting Expo '86 - "and when we produce that, that will be our last episode - and Colin will be in it."

- "How long will the show go on? And what about a movie?" Joel said that as long as the ratings are up there and people like what they do, there will still be episodes produced, He forsees a movie eventually being done, but what with the rigours of doing the show there's just not enogh time right now to do a movie, and when they do the movie they want to give it their undivided attention.

-"Any characters you especially like writing for?" - Tim said that he especially likes writing lines for Ralph (huge cheer from audience!), because it's "a fine balance between Zen and stupid."

- "Are Lenny and Carl gay?" Joel: "although you may have seen something last Sunday that gave you that impression, Lenny and Carl are just really good friends."

One especial treat for the audience - if they looked under their seat, certain seats would have a paper with a coloured dot taped underneath. Ten lucky audience members would walk away with a DVD boxed set of Season One, and yours truly won the second prize, a copy of "A Complete Guide To Our Favorite Family". Third prize was the most recent Simpsons Comics softcover collection.

All in all, a great and informative evening out......

Dan Dreibelbis, Guitar Nerd - Better Living Through Home Recording. Now On MP3.COM for your listening pleasure! http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/338/dan_dreibelbis.html
The RackDaniel Dreibelbis

Drunk and full of pie, Daniel Dreibelbis wrote:

Sounds like fun... but... I'm really getting tired of the ACRONYM that is "OFF".

Chadderack OO BABY BABY! COME ON BACK, I BEG YA! START SQUEEZIN' ME SO HARD/ LIKE A ROTTEN RUTABAGA!
AcK!The Rack

On Thu, 14 Feb 2002 05:41:23 GMT, [email] (The Rack) wrote:

OFF doesn't seem to mind the acronym, though, does it? ;)

TTYL

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The RackDaniel Dreibelbis

Drunk and full of pie, Daniel Dreibelbis wrote:

Dumbasses. All I have to say about that.

Dumbasses. All I have to say about that.

Dumbasses. All I have to say about that.

Other than those things... very nice. Dumbasses :-) Seriously, we here in the lower 48 are envious.

Chadderack Hello, Bert's Taco Palace? Adios. www.snpp.com/episodes/scg.html
Greg BairDaniel Dreibelbis

Daniel Dreibelbis spewed forth in news:[email] on 14 Feb 2002:

<SNIP SNIP>

Colin Mochrie is hilarious. I would love to see him in an ep. He's probably the funniest Scottish-Canadian with a bald spot ever. Little known fact: He was in Man on the Moon (1999) but his scenes were cut. Their loss, I bet. I watched him on Comedy Central for years on "Who's Line is it Anyway?".

Greg Bair "If gold rusts, what will iron do?" - Chaucer http://www.geocities.com/gregnhs99
Daniel DreibelbisGreg Bair

In article , Greg Bair wrote:

agreed. When he was added to _This Hour Has 22 Minutes_'s cast this season, he had the task of filling the very big shoes of Rick Mercer, himself a comic genius. Wonder of wonders, he's pulled ahead with flying colours, particularly with the demented commentator Max Pointy (a dead-on parody of CBC commentator Rex Murphy).

"Geri Halliwell, former Spice Girl, has told the British press that she has found God. Ms. Halliwell says that she will now attempt the tougher word jumbles" - Colin Mochrie

Dan Dreibelbis, Guitar Nerd - Better Living Through Home Recording. Now On MP3.COM for your listening pleasure! http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/338/dan_dreibelbis.html
Ken CarriereDaniel Dreibelbis

"Daniel Dreibelbis" wrote in message news:[email]...

Thank you so much for posting this. It was very interesting. I'm sorry I missed the evening.

--Ken
AcK!Ken Carriere

On Thu, 14 Feb 2002 17:18:47 GMT, "Ken Carriere" wrote:

I'm going to continue teasing the newsgroup with other tidbits I'm deciphering from the illegible scrawl that constitutes my notes of the evening.

On the subject of Barney, they said that he will "probably not" fall off the wagon.

They were tempted to take a cheap shot, with Barney saying "I'm a coward, like all recovering alcoholics" but decided to pass on that one.

TTYL

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I find this both stupid and incredibly hard to believe. How could It bring cheers from the audience. There were no boos?

David

In article , "Chicken Chicken Head" wrote:

the boos came when the questioner said that _Family Guy_ was cutting, on the edge comedy that had obviously changed the Simpson's approach to comedy. And when Joel said it had just been cancelled, there were cheers. I was quite surprised myself, I knew that most people didn't like the show, but universally loathing it?

Dan Dreibelbis, Guitar Nerd - Better Living Through Home Recording. Now On MP3.COM for your listening pleasure! http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/338/dan_dreibelbis.html
AcK!Daniel Dreibelbis

On Thu, 14 Feb 2002 21:48:32 -0500, Daniel Dreibelbis wrote:

Well, it's not universal, it's just that I got drowned out...

TTYL

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oh, forgot to mention something of interest:

Joel did mention an upcoming episode for next season that features Mick Jagger visiting Springfield, which we knew from news reports a month ago. Well, it turns out that we'll be seeing three other musicians in that episode: Keith Richards, Lenny Kravitz and Elvis Costello. Seems somehow some wires got crossed and all four musicians showed up to record for the episode, so they re-wrote the script to accomodate all four.

Dan Dreibelbis, Guitar Nerd - Better Living Through Home Recording. Now On MP3.COM for your listening pleasure! http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/338/dan_dreibelbis.html
AcK!Daniel Dreibelbis

On Thu, 14 Feb 2002 21:54:42 -0500, Daniel Dreibelbis wrote:

Less wires crossing, more surprisingly universal acceptance, is how I understood it. :)

TTYL

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Timothy AlexanderDaniel Dreibelbis

Daniel,

I, too, was at the symposium on Wednesday night and, for what it's worth, here's one man's opinion:

--I also enjoyed watching "Behind the Laughter" on the big screen with a large group of people. Even though I've watched that particular ep a thousand times, it *still* makes me laugh.

--The program was too short. The whole thing lasted less than an hour and a half. Take away "Behind the Laughter and you've got only an hour for both the forum and the audience Q&A.

--Tim Long's shtick got old fast. Smart ass one-liner after smart ass one-liner. IMHO, I wish he would have been more serious (at least with the serious questions). But he constantly went for the laugh. He was trying to be funny (and, I have to admit, at times he was). But, after a short bit, his act got extremely predictable.

--Joel Cohen, on the other hand, handled things beautifully. He said much less than Tim Long but what he did say was much more clever. And, when the moment warranted it, he was serious. For me, he came across as a nice guy with whom you'd like to have a beer with.

--Colin Mochrie. I honestly didn't get the impression that he was in awe of "The Simpsons". Frankly, I wouldn't be surprised to find out that he was just tired (he's on pretty much every television show up here in Canada). Also, I never got the sense that the three of them (Colin, Tim, Joel) established either a connection or a rhythm.

--Lastly, my biggest complaint of the evening was that it turned out to be a love fest for all things Simpson. As a long time viewer of the show, I was surprised that nobody mentioned that the present show isn't even in the same league as the golden early years. For instance, Tim Long wrote "Saddlesore Galactica" (with the horribly unfunny singing evil jockeys). This ep doesn't hold a candle to another horse-related story - Season Three's "Lisa's Pony".

Now, I realize that I'm an old fart and that the early seasons were the good ol' days. However, I truly believe that the show, while still occasionally funny, isn't nearly as *consistently* clever as it once was. For me, "The Simpsons" are no longer required viewing. And that's because - as Tim Long himself pointed out - writing jokes is easy, writing stories is hard.

The early seasons had the main plot and the sub-plot(s) beautifully woven together. Now all we get are a nonsensical First Act and a outlandish/weird Third Act.

Anyway, enough from me. In closing, DYN:

--At the end of the evening, Tim Long returned the script to the gentleman that had handed it to him during the Q&A (as he should have - there are legal ramifications here)?

--They didn't play the two minute tape that was shown earlier in the day on local television that highlights all the Canadian references during the entire run of "The Simpsons"?

Greg BairTimothy Alexander

"Timothy Alexander" spewed forth in news:WC8b8.73$[email] on 15 Feb 2002:

Is he any relation to David X. Cohen, Futurama's co-creator? I realize Cohen is a fairly common name, but, hey it could happen.

Greg Bair "If gold rusts, what will iron do?" - Chaucer http://www.geocities.com/gregnhs99
AcK!Greg Bair

On Fri, 15 Feb 2002 16:42:00 GMT, Greg Bair wrote:

I think they're not, since Joel is from Canada.

Besides, Cohen is so common, David has to add that "X" because there already was a David Cohen in the trade organization he belongs to...

TTYL

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AcK!Timothy Alexander

On Fri, 15 Feb 2002 14:07:50 GMT, "Timothy Alexander" wrote:

Damn, three confirmed a.t.s'ers present there... how disturbing can this get? :)

The big screen experience was unforgettable.

I want more.

More.

More I say!

Agreed... wish they lasted more.

Yeah, he wasn't very talkative at times... oh wait, which one of them was sitting in the middle and which one was on the left?... :)

Seriously, I'm not sure I got this straight....

Actually, I found Joel sometimes cut things short (I do remember which was which, Joel was on the left...), saying "yes" and not elaborating on answers to some of Colin's questions...

It was hit and miss...

My bad, I didn't do much research into them... so I squandered my question on the Butterfingers law thing...

They did recognize the fact that Saddlesore Galactica was a disaster in the third act, though... not an apology, but they realize things were bad.

I should've commented on that... oh well, I had my question.

Why didn't you go ahead and ask that one, though? ;)

Yup, I was there at the stage and noticed... it's all about legalism.

I think that's a Global-specific thing... would've been nice, though.

TTYL

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Timothy AlexanderAcK!

"AcK!" wrote in message news:[email]...

be a

was

same

and the sub-plot(s) beautifully woven

outlandish/weird

Good question. Two reasons:

Reason #1 (The Lame Reason): I was sitting smack-dab in the middle of the audience so it would have been difficult to get to a microphone.

Reason # 2 (The Reason With More Substance): The way the evening was progressing, what with everyone admiring everything about anything, I would have been a colossal wet rag. During my time on this earth, I've already ruined too many parties (16) and me saying something negative would have been, as we used to say way back when, a bummer.

And, in all honesty, it was fun being in a positively-charged environment - especially a positively-charged Simpsons environment.

Dr MusicTimothy Alexander

"Timothy Alexander" wrote in message news:jvlb8.9$[email]...

would

So, lessee... this makes 3 Christmases I've saved versus 8 I've ruined... 2 were kind of a draw.

Dr Music P.S. Parking was ample.

AcK!Timothy Alexander

On Sat, 16 Feb 2002 04:47:11 GMT, "Timothy Alexander" wrote:

Aw, I would've applauded your wet-rag-edness. :)

TTYL

... Chief, you just gave artillery our coordinates. [email] remove "spa" to email
AcK!Daniel Dreibelbis

On Thu, 14 Feb 2002 00:25:05 -0500, Daniel Dreibelbis wrote:

Thank you, *I* was the person who raised that question.

Uh oh, now Daniel knows who I am but I don't know who he is.

Augh!

Were you taking notes too? :)

The most frequently censored part of the episodes, they noted, are the jokes about religion, because they end up taking a lot of heat for them (the most of any jokes in fact).

His exact words being "God Bless You and I hope you get a life soon."

(yeah, I realize how sad it is I took notes... <grin>)

Yeah, they enjoyed watching FG crash and burn...

Also note that he returned it at the end of the night to the guy...

in-bred Dalmatian, IIRC... :)

It was still funny, though... :)

A nice joke. :)

Hey Jouni, time to update your movie doc! :)

A year or two after it's cancelled, is what he noted, IIRC.

He also noted how OFF is one of the few things that's successful for Fox. :)

Yeah, there was a comment that there's a tendency to make every character either "retarded, or gay," and they have to be careful not to do that, to prevent themselves from destroying the characters...

Hey, maybe I did see you stand up after all... :)

There was also news about an episode developed that includes Lenny Kravitz, Mick Jagger and some other big rock stars.

Interestingly, all the stars who are set to be in that episode were written in, in the hope that one of them would say yes to being on the show. In the end, and to the writer's great surprise (I think it was Tim writing this ep), they *all* agreed, so they had to find a way to fit all those stars in... there's a sneak preview for a 2003 episode. :)

TTYL

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