I am tired of this message board. So much negativity. Sure some episodes are better than others but believe me people they are all great, because they are part of The Simpsons, the greatest show ever on TV. It is not right to say "Worst Episode Ever" for any episode, because each episode can appeal to different people. I especially hate people who think evrery episode after season 9 is bad, because that is just not fair. Of course we are going to love the earlier episodes more, because those are the ones that got us hooked. But if the series had started at season 10, we would probably all watch the Simpsons just as much, and think while not classic, it is still a good funny show. So basically I'm saying if you've ever said anything bad about the Simpsons, get off your high horse and just enjoy it while it is still on the air!
I love the Simpsons but hate the negativity of this board
you have a Very great point!!
"Casey O4" wrote in message news:[email]...
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On 27 Nov 2002 01:36:08 GMT, [email] (Casey O4) wrote:
Don't you hate pants?
On Wed, 27 Nov 2002 02:30:59 GMT, Scott Munro wrote:
Sorry about the multiple post. My newsreader told me my message wasn't getting posted.
On 27 Nov 2002 01:36:08 GMT, [email] (Casey O4) wrote:
Don't you hate pants?
On 27 Nov 2002 01:36:08 GMT, [email] (Casey O4) wrote:
Don't you hate pants?
"Casey O4" said:
are
no one is doubting the fact that the simpsons are god's greatest invention, ever, but even this show is capable of sucking at times. blind patriotism gets us nowhere.
true.
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also true. it *is* important to remember that the show is still capable of creating a good episode at this point. the negativity surrounding the previewing of large marge was justified, considering the potential for suckiness it contained. however, on the most part, i agree that shows shouldn't be dissed before they come out (again, large marge being the exception). i'll leave it to you to determine if such criticism was justified.
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not necessarily, and besides, it's impossible to either prove or disprove this theory. of course, we are all entitled to an opinion, which this is.
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if we present vaild arguments we have every right to point out how the show is fading. while, unlike CBG, i don't feel fox "owes" us anything for being such loyal viewers, i *do* believe that most people on this NG have been watching the show for some time and are therefore qualified to voice their concerns on a show that is a PART OF US ALL ...
Part Of Us All ...
part of us all ...
-stoops
mister stoops wrote in message news:as1d04$d78$[email]...
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invention,
And constantly bitching how bad it has gotten us where?
Al Jean taking over as executive producer and attempting to improve the show based on the general fan consensus?
["Jamie"; Wed, 27 Nov 2002 17:29:55 GMT]
I'm coming in late. When did this happen?
["mister stoops"; Wed, 27 Nov 2002 03:08:50 GMT]
Thank you!
mister snoops, this is the worst thing I have ever read on this newsgroup.
Number 1, the Simpsons are not a creation of God, maybe Matt Groening and company are, but not a TV show.
And now you dare critizise patriotism in a time in which we have terriots threating the world, especially the United States? You know, it does not matter what you are placing in the context of patriotism, the concept of "blind patriotism" that you bring up goes to show how much care you have for your country, and there sure isn't a whole lot from the way I see it.
I mean, you saw what happened on 9/11/01 right? Part of that is rightfully blamed on a nation whose patriotism went down the toliet over the years. I mean, it showed how we can't believe that the U.S. is just a country, it's a nation that we are blessed to have for the price that our founding fathers have paid to ensure it. I mean look, our system has worked so well that we are on top of the world. But to keep that status means that we have to care for our nation, and continue to pay as high of a price for freedoms that were given to us if we care for them at all.
A true American is one who truely cares for what they have 100%. 99.9% does not cut it. If you are an American, you are either fully patriotic, or you automatically hate your country (and that is w/o if's, ands, or buts). Could I get anymore simple?
I doubt it.....
["Jamie"; Fri, 29 Nov 2002 12:32:11 GMT]
Dang it! Beat me to the punch! Geez, what a weirdo.
You can be patriotic and have criticisms about how things are being done in the government. Blind patriotism, which would be automatically supporting every government action simply because it's the government, is not good. They'll just try to do anything they want just because they can. And our being attacked on 9/11 does not somehow automatically make every decision from the government an intelligent one. Should we attack Iraq? I truly do not know. I've heard good arguments for both sides.
And no, you couldn't get any more simple. By simple, I mean "stupid." ________________________________________________________________
If love of money is the root of all evil, why do churches want it so badly?
Remove "bination" to reply.
Terrorist threat? Bullshit. Bush went overboard a LONG time ago. All that's happening is that the tragedy of 9/11 is being capitalized on to help the higher-ups reach their goals. --------- http://www.ssjzion.com I found once I had a city living in my bellybutton full of people who did nothing but have sex. Does that mean I intend to force people to have sex in my bellybutton? -Talen on dream psychology.
No, that's a load of horsecrap (yeah, I should have kept this to one post, but I hit send early). You see, I don't hate America, but I despise our current government, and this BS "War on Terror." Does that make me a terrorist? You're starting to sound like GWB yourself. --------- http://www.ssjzion.com I found once I had a city living in my bellybutton full of people who did nothing but have sex. Does that mean I intend to force people to have sex in my bellybutton? -Talen on dream psychology.
Remember folks, it is BAD to sound like GWB. ________________________________________________________________
If love of money is the root of all evil, why do churches want it so badly?
Remove "bination" to reply.
GB: Hi everyone, I'm George Bush.
(Silence)
GB: Former... *President*... George Bush....
Crowd: Oh right, yeah... etc
T'other Bush I know, but still, I love that little scene :)
["Herb Powell"; Sat, 07 Dec 2002 10:21:05 GMT]
CROWD: Hi, Mr. Bush!
I think you're right. There is way too much negativity about the decent seasons. However, if you look back historically this has always been the case ever since the beginning right from season 1. People didn't like the new look in season 2 and then they didn't like the new production house in season 3. People don't like newer episode because they aren't familiar with them yet. In five years from now people will be used to seasons 10, 11, 12 and 13 and will not think they are so bad.
I think a lot of people don't like change. The Simpsons have definitly changed over the years. The characters have grown because the show is organic. (Barney giving up drinking for example) The shows writers know (for the most part) when a joke is no longer funny (like "Don't have a cow man." or the whole thing with Homer and the penants.) If the show didn't change it never would have lasted this long.
Personally I think the last few season have been the best. I'm watched the Simpsons since i was a kid and have grown up with them. I remember around seasons 4,5 and 6 people talked about the show going downhill and not being the same. People also said earlier seasons were better and that the show should end. But i'm open to change. I think maybe the people who don't like the newer episodes don't like change.
Like I said, in a couple years it will be seasons 14, 15 and 16 people will say are the worst seasons. Obviously since the rating have been really high lately there is still some serious interest in the show.
are
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No matter how long the show goes on for, there will always be people like me who would rather watch Homer reading the phone book than have nothing new to watch at all.
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Amen to that.
"Casey O4" wrote in message news:[email]...
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THANK YOU! I'm glad to hear someone else say what I've been thinking as I read all these whiny nitpicky "geeks" (I resemble that remark) ripping apart what's still one of the highlights of television today! As Bart said to the comic-book shop guy about the Itchy and Scratchy episode with Poochy, (something like this) "They've given you years of entertainment for free, what could they possibly owe you?"
Back in those days we used to wear an onion on our belt, cause that was the style at the time...
If you don't like "geeks," as you call us, then what the hell are you even doing at a newsgroup in the first place? This is where the "geeks" come to talk about the show. Casual fans don't post in here regularly. I don't feel I'm owed anything, but I do feel that if I'm going to spend 30 minutes of my life watching the show plus commercials, it had better be good. As of late, I only watch a new Simpsons episode if I'm not doing or watching anything else. But I used to tune into the show no matter what in the past.
...and that's why bananas are called 'yellow fatty beans.' ________________________________________________________________
If love of money is the root of all evil, why do churches want it so badly?
Remove "bination" to reply.
it is hard to separate the complete morons who post one-line "Worst Episode Ever. That stunk, I switched it off halfway through and it was the worst episode ever. Growneng is a fucking faggot" from the people who actually care about the show and who provide criticism for discussion purposes. but try. yes ATS has a lot of idiots, but they are easily ignored
Jamie wrote:
Well said. Let me use your post to add some further general points.
People in this thread say things like "I�d watch new episodes, even if they show nothing but Homer reading a phone book." Now what kind of argument is that? Look, there�s Homer and he reads a phone book. Wow. Pure brilliance. Of course best thing on TV ever (because it has the name Simpsons on it.)
Seriously, that�s no argumentation that leads to anything. To repeat myself - indifference isn�t better than pointless negativity. Both are no base for discussion.
Information and independent thinking are two important things. It�s wrong to say "The Simpsons are the best show ever because all my friends say so" and it�s equally wrong to say "The Simpsons are now the worst show ever because all the hip people in ATS say so." Think, people, think. Plus you can�t criticize episodes without having proper information about certain things.
There is a lot of pointless negativity in ATS and there are whiny people and people who complain just because it�s so "hip" to be against new Simpsons. There are trite "Worst Episode Ever" etc phrases, like you said. But what do we hear from the "Hooray for Everything" side? The same trite stuff in different form.
"Criticism is blasphemy", "I don�t want to hear anything bad about the best show ever", "I want my own newsgroup where people love the show and say only friendly things", "The Simpsons are too good for criticism", "This message board is stupid because people criticize the great and wonderful Simpsons", "Only nerds and people with no life criticize such a freaking hilarious fun cartoon", "It�s the Simpsons, the show all people love and worship", "You are no real Simpson fans but just some people without life", "C�mon, admit it, Simpsons rule", "You stink. Homah is da kewl ruler of all da world", "My dad knows Matt Groening and Matt said you are all idiots" etc etc. It goes on like that.
What�s the point? Is everything with the name "Simpsons" on it above mortal criticism or what? Is every new season automatically the best season ever? Is it forbidden to notice problems? Is simple fun really everything? Is The Simpsons only there to give you a cheap laugh and nothing else? Is cartoon conformism good?
There is of course much more complaining in a newsgroup than in a webforum or message board (though many people no longer know the difference between internet and usenet.) But it�s the purpose of every newsgroup to be like that. Instead of being thankful for a place where they can read other opinions and new points of view people just say stuff like the phrases above. "I don�t want to hear criticism about the best show ever. Shut up, nerds." That�s pretty sad.
It�s a TV show and it has brilliant episodes, good episodes, mediocre episodes, weak episodes and even truly bad episodes (at least IMO), the latter especially in recent years. I feel that and I say that.
The writers are normal human beings and many of them (e.g. Al Jean, Mike Reiss, George Meyer) said in interviews that they are aware of certain problems in recent seasons and that they know about all the criticism and partly even appreciate it. Al Jean said in an interview that he don�t want indifference from the fanbase. And he�s right.
Simple devotion and indifference are the end of every active fandom. That�s something all the people who dislike criticism in any form should seriously think about.
Chris
they
It wasn't an argument, it was just a personal opinion.
To me, after 14 years the Simpsons is a lot like a marriage. The initial sparkle may have fizzled, but over the years it has become comforting and familiar. While the halycon days may be long gone and you're left with blandness and mediocrity, you just wouldn't want to leave it, becasue it still make you happy, albeit in a different way now. For you see, The Simpsons is also like an orange - first you have the skin, then the sweet sweeeet innards.... (gobble gobble).
Looking forward to the Season 52 finale - Homer Reads The Phone Book:
"Oooooh, Aaron A Aaronson, heh heh heh, stupid name...." :)
Yeah. There are a few actors that i would pay my $10 to watch them read the phone book but i look at it as entertainment, not a life altering event. That and i'm easily amused.
Good analogy. The honeymoon is over but we stay anyway because we're still in love.
sounds good to me. (and thanks for the morning laugh)
I'll add something to this. If you're going to compare the show to marriage, the first few years would be like when everything was hunky dory and your spouse and you were madly in love. Then, several years later, the spouse started drinking heavily and acting idiotic. But you can't leave because of habit. ________________________________________________________________
If love of money is the root of all evil, why do churches want it so badly?
Remove "bination" to reply.
Herb Powell wrote in message news:as55i5$ojn$[email]...
is
Beautifully said! To the point! What the hell are you doing here? :o)
-Bob
Ok that was a well stated post but you started it off with a quote of mine...I did say i would watch Homer read the phone book RATHER THAN HAVE NOTHING NEW AT ALL. Nowhere in my four posts that i've posted since coming here did i state that the Simpsons is the best show on Tv. There is only one show that i make a point to be sure i'm in front of the tv to watch each week and it's not The Simpsons. I also said in another thread that the negative discussions, i find interesting, but the name calling and "worst season ever" comments without giving reasons why, make you people who do that sound like children. So don't use my quote to start a rant that doesn't even apply to my quote. I personally love NGs for the very reasons that you stated i don't like them. It's nice to have people with differing views to discuss the topic with. Well all except A.R.S. They're just crazy.
Weebil28 wrote:
Your quote just came to my mind as a pretty good example for a "I don�t care about the content as long as it is the Simpsons" mentality. Sorry if I quoted you in a misunderstandable way or too much out of context.
I also didn�t mean you personally when I spoke about people who consider the show always as best thing on TV. Such people just combine the opinion shown in your phone book line with their own opinion that every episode is always automatically the best thing on TV, no matter what actually happens in episodes but just because it�s The Simpsons.
Your line seemed to be a good start for the rant. I didn�t mean to refer to you as person but to refer to a certain mentality among fans. It would have been better if I had made up some own quote. I apologize for using yours.
I didn�t mean you. I was refering to the sort of people who don�t want to hear other opinions than their own and who don�t understand the concept of a newsgroup.
Chris
ok i get ya now and i agree which is why i found it funny that you used my quote to state your opinion. It's funny though because i KNOW i've seen "bad" episodes but yet i can't think of one off of the top of my head....But then again i also can't name my favourite season because i have no idea which episodes were in what season.
Chris Pfeiler wrote in message news:[email]...
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Hey, Chris! Aren't you the one who told me to never pick out one thing to comment on, and to get to know the person's ideas before commenting? Hmm!?
Your old pal,
-Bob
CaseyO4 wrote:
Good point. But there is a difference between aimless negativity and constructive criticism. Nothing but blind devotion and pointless praise would turn the NG into a very boring place and a big load of useless "Best Episode Ever" posts wouldn�t be better than a big load of useless "Worst Episode Ever" posts. Diversity is the key to constructive talk.
As a whole, the Simpsons is still the greatest show (like I said a few days ago) but I have the feeling that the recent seasons destroy now more and more of that reputation.
People say "What�s the sense of all the criticism. The writers don�t care" but that�s IMO not the real point. The meaning of aimed criticism is to create discussion culture, to express opinions, and also to face other opinions and points of view and to consider them fair and open-minded. Plus it�s important that the writers and producers know (just know) that there are critical people who don�t just join the mass of indifferent fans who consider everything with the name "Simpsons" on it automatically as so great that it is above criticism. Where would the show be now without its critical fans?
There�s a lot of stuff to criticize in recent episodes (even some of the writers admitted that) and even more if you became a fan of the show because of its uniqueness and smart wit and subversive and satirical qualities and not just because of simple humor. From my point of view (and I think I have good personal reasons and not just some overdone "Everything sucks now" attitude) many episodes past Season 9 are bad or at least pretty weak and most of Seasons 11 and 12 seems truly bad to me. But that�s just me and I watch episodes often in a different way than many other people.
Agree.
Meh. That�s IMO a way too generalized argument. I watched the show because of the qualities it had in the very first years and I still watch it to catch glimpses of that quality and of the old spirit. I doubt I would watch it (and be a fan) if they would have really started the show in Season 10 style, it would be just like any other mainstream cartoon then. And how long would it survive in that style? It needs its roots and its old style, it�s the base of the huge success.
Chris, posting way too much in ATS. I really should get a life ;-).
me to,
"Casey O4" wrote in message news:[email]...
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the simpsons are about happniess and fun "Casey O4" wrote in message news:[email]...
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I totally agree with you. I tried making a similar point earlier, but was bombarded by a slew of unhappy, misguided fools who call themselves "fans". Whatever "flaws" the show does possess are irrelevant, because The Simpson's is still better than 100% of the crap that clog the network and cable prime time slots.
Someone complaining about this show, is like someone having a fillet mingon served to them and complaining that the bacon looks a little under-seasoned, or a billionaire who is upset that he doesn't have $10,000 more in his estate. It just doesn't make any sense. Maybe it's a personality flaw or something like that. I just don't know.
As for me, this show brings nothing but joy. I like just about all of the episodes except for a couple that come to mind, like "Lisa the Tree Hugger" and "Pokey Mom", but even those episodes are more enjoyable than any of the mindless network sitcoms that currently occupy primetime. The current episodes don't really bother me as much as it appears to bother you. Frankly, I think it would be a terrible shame if Fox pulled the plug on The Simpsons. I don't care how bad you guys think the current episodes "suck", would you want Fox to do that?
And for that matter, they don't "suck", as many of say. According To Jims sucks. My Wife and Kids sucks. Becker sucks. I'm sure you intelligent people could come up with a less...well, superlative word for your criticisms.
"Casey O4" wrote in message news:[email]...
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"jmartin92" wrote in message news:KSbF9.17218$[email]... I like just about all of the
Hugger"
What did I do deserve this sappy hokum?
Of course Becker sucks. But Becker wasn't a brilliantly written show in its first several seasons, only to start taking a dive later on. We complain because we've seen just how much the Simpsons is capable of. If the show had started out like it is now, with endless celebrity roles and other shenanigans, the show would have been cancelled after a few episodes. This is why I think Family Guy didn't succeed. It was funny, but it was ALL gags. There was no heart, nothing compelling me to tune in each week no matter what. ________________________________________________________________
If love of money is the root of all evil, why do churches want it so badly?
Remove "bination" to reply.
jmartin92 wrote:
Your point was fatally flawed because you employed the "true fans" argument. Every fan of the series is entitled to point out that an episode or season isn't as good as its predecessors if he or she chooses to do so. People aren't "true fans" simply because they criticize things instead of treating them like the best thing since oxygen.
The show's flaws are quite relevant. Without them there would be no discussion here, and they do demonstrate how the show has changed over the years. You don't have to agree with a person's negative opinion of the show, but you certainly can't tell them that they can't say that they didn't like it. No fan is required to like everything associated with the series.
It's better than all of the crap on TV, but that doesn't say much about how good it is when compared to all series currently on TV. The Simpsons is only better than about eighty percent of the shows on TV today.
No, it's more like complaining because you were served fillet minion, but ordered a steak. The fillt minion is perfectly fine, but it isn't what you wanted.
All series end sometime. Stopping The Simpsons now would end the descent into the realms of the mindless sitcoms you claim to hate so much.
Yes, many of them do suck. Some are even deserving of the title "worst episode ever." I can't think of a single phrase that describes "Kill the Alligator and Run" better.
The word works perfectly well when describing many of the newer episodes of the series.
Well, I have to give credit where credit is due: Excellent argument. I don't agree with every single one of your points, but overall I see what you mean and I agree. I guess I was just a little shocked by how negative the tone of this newsgroup was when I first got here, and it caused me to create this passionate arguments. I apologize to the group.
"Exatron" wrote in message news:[email]...
There's something called expressing personal opinion. While "Worst Episode Ever" is used in a tongue-in-cheek manner, it is overused. However, when we don't like certain episodes or even certain seasons, we don't have to sugarcoat our posts just to appease people who do like those episodes. So what if every episode appeals to someone? If that were the criteria for not criticizing something, nothing anywhere would ever be criticized because someone likes it. If you're tired of the negativity, don't read this newsgroup or don't read the posts criticizing current episodes. Because we are the diehardcore fans and it takes a lot more than the family going to exotic locations or toilet humor to amuse us. ________________________________________________________________
If love of money is the root of all evil, why do churches want it so badly?
Remove "bination" to reply.
["Casey O4"; Wed, 27 Nov 2002 01:36:08 GMT]
I agree with you on the negativity of this newsgroup, but saying that every episode is great just because, gosh darn it, it's "The Simpsons"? You're saying that no matter how bad, how totally awful, an episode might be, it's not bad. That's ridiculousness.
well, it's "blind patriotism", as someone earlier mentioned. which is quite expected really, as most of the American population has the same attitude with regards to the government.
Is it blind patriotism towards the simpons or just blind love? Different people are entertained by different things and while i admit i've seen some pretty bad episodes of the Simpsons i can guarantee that i'll still be watching them for the second time or more in reruns.
Weebil28 wrote in message news:[email]...
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That's too subtle a difference for some to see!
Different people
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I feel the same way.
And, maybe that's how Casey really feels, too, in less passionate moments!
-Bob
[email] (Casey O4) wrote in message news:...
You know...it's really funny how people like yourself can tell other people to 'get a life', or it's 'only a show' because they constently whine about it, but you've just put yourself on the other side of the fence by making a mere 'tv show' into some kind of god-like entity that can only be praised and worshipped.
I don't think that is really so much the case for me as much as "if you truly don't like something then why not just shut up about it and stay away from theboard" I only started reading this board a few days ago. I love the constructive conversations from people who didn't like a particular episode and can eloquently state why but the whining about "worst season ever" and just leaving it at that is useless.
I love the
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yes, everyone knows this. the glib Worst Episode Ever posters are detrimental to the overall reputation of the simpsons internet fanbase.
This is the feeling that i'm getting. That there are intelligent posters in this newsgroup. It's why i'm staying around and looking forward to discussing future episodes. Now i may even have to make a point to watch the Simpsons again. I missed the Large Marge episode and now i wished i hadn't.
Weebil28 wrote:
People have every right to complain if they don't like something. Nobody is forcing you to read those threads, so kindly stop whining about them.
On Fri, 29 Nov 2002 01:54:12 GMT, "Exatron" wrote:
But if people have every right to complain about the low quality of the show, don't people also have the right to complain about the low quality of complaints?
Just as you have the right to complain about his complaint complaint, and I have the right to complain about your complaint complaint complaint.
Etc.
Wow, my message got 49 responses, mostly positive. Maybe there is hope for the newsgroup afterall. Keep it coming people, push out the jive, bring in the love....
CaseyO4 wrote:
I�d say your post started a mostly positive discussion about the uselessness of pointless negativity but also about the necessity of critical discussion and different opinions.
49 replies is a good result in ATS. So why do my reviews always get so little replies? ;-)
Chris
Chris Pfeiler wrote in message news:[email]...
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BECAUSE YOU.....
(No, Bob! Be nice! It's almost Christmastime.)
Casey O4 wrote in message news:[email]...
for the
the
BRING IT!! (shaking fist)
-Bob