A different perspective on the terrorist attack

Sep 16, 2001, 4:06 AM ET23 posts by 8 posters
23 posts
Reach The Sky

INEVITABLE RING TO THE UNIMAGINABLE By John Pilger If the attacks on America have their source in the Islamic world, who can really be surprised?

Two days earlier, eight people were killed in southern Iraq when British and American planes bombed civilian areas. To my knowledge, not a word appeared in the mainstream media in Britain.

An estimated 200,000 Iraqis, according to the Health Education Trust in London, died during and in the immediate aftermath of the slaughter known as the Gulf War.

This was never news that touched public consciousness in the west.

At least a million civilians, half of them children, have since died in Iraq as a result of a medieval embargo imposed by the United States and Britain.

In Pakistan and Afghanistan, the Mujadeen, which gave birth to the fanatical Taliban, was largely the creation of the CIA.

The terrorist training camps where Osama bin Laden, now "America's most wanted man", allegedly planned his attacks, were built with American money and backing.

In Palestine, the enduring illegal occupation by Israel would have collapsed long ago were it not for US backing.

Far from being the terrorists of the world, the Islamic peoples have been its victims - principally the victims of US fundamentalism, whose power, in all its forms, military, strategic and economic, is the greatest source of terrorism on earth.

This fact is censored from the Western media, whose "coverage" at best minimises the culpability of imperial powers. Richard Falk, professor of international relations at Princeton, put it this way: "Western foreign policy is presented almost exclusively through a self-righteous, one-way legal/moral screen (with) positive images of Western values and innocence portrayed as threatened, validating a campaign of unrestricted political violence."

That Tony Blair, whose government sells lethal weapons to Israel and has sprayed Iraq and Yugoslavia with cluster bombs and depleted uranium and was the greatest arms supplier to the genocidists in Indonesia, can be taken seriously when he now speaks about the "shame" of the "new evil of mass terrorism" says much about the censorship of our collective sense of how the world is managed.

One of Blair's favourite words - "fatuous" - comes to mind. Alas, it is no comfort to the families of thousands of ordinary Americans who have died so terribly that the perpetrators of their suffering may be the product of Western policies. Did the American establishment believe that it could bankroll and manipulate events in the Middle East without cost to itself, or rather its own innocent people?

The attacks on Tuesday come at the end of a long history of betrayal of the Islamic and Arab peoples: the collapse of the Ottoman Empire, the foundation of the state of Israel, four Arab-Israeli wars and 34 years of Israel's brutal occupation of an Arab nation: all, it seems, obliterated within hours by Tuesday's acts of awesome cruelty by those who say they represent the victims of the West's intervention in their homelands.

"America, which has never known modern war, now has her own terrible league table: perhaps as many as 20,000 victims."

As Robert Fisk points out, in the Middle East, people will grieve the loss of innocent life, but they will ask if the newspapers and television networks of the west ever devoted a fraction of the present coverage to the half-a-million dead children of Iraq, and the 17,500 civilians killed in Israel's 1982 invasion of Lebanon. The answer is no. There are deeper roots to the atrocities in the US, which made them almost inevitable.

It is not only the rage and grievance in the Middle East and south Asia. Since the end of the cold war, the US and its sidekicks, principally Britain, have exercised, flaunted, and abused their wealth and power while the divisions imposed on human beings by them and their agents have grown as never before.

An elite group of less than a billion people now take more than 80 per cent of the world's wealth.

In defence of this power and privilege, known by the euphemisms "free market" and "free trade", the injustices are legion: from the illegal blockade of Cuba, to the murderous arms trade, dominated by the US, to its trashing of basic environmental decencies, to the assault on fragile economies by institutions such as the World Trade Organisation that are little more than agents of the US Treasury and the European central banks, and the demands of the World Bank and the International Monetary Fund in forcing the poorest nations to repay unrepayable debts; to a new US "Vietnam" in Colombia and the sabotage of peace talks between North and South Korea (in order to shore up North Korea's "rogue nation" status).

Western terror is part of the recent history of imperialism, a word that journalists dare not speak or write.

The expulsion of the population of Diego Darcia in the 1960s by the Wilson government received almost no press coverage.

Their homeland is now an American nuclear arms dump and base from which US bombers patrol the Middle East.

In Indonesia, in 1965/6, a million people were killed with the complicity of the US and British governments: the Americans supplying General Suharto with assassination lists, then ticking off names as people were killed.

"Getting British companies and the World Bank back in there was part of the deal", says Roland Challis, who was the BBC's south east Asia correspondent.

British behaviour in Malaya was no different from the American record in Vietnam, for which it proved inspirational: the withholding of food, villages turned into concentration camps and more than half a million people forcibly dispossessed.

In Vietnam, the dispossession, maiming and poisoning of an entire nation was apocalyptic, yet diminished in our memory by Hollywood movies and by what Edward Said rightly calls cultural imperialism.

In Operation Phoenix, in Vietnam, the CIA arranged the homicide of around 50,000 people. As official documents now reveal, this was the model for the terror in Chile that climaxed with the murder of the democratically elected leader Salvador Allende, and within 10 years, the crushing of Nicaragua.

All of it was lawless. The list is too long for this piece.

Now imperialism is being rehabilitated. American forces currently operate with impunity from bases in 50 countries.

"Full spectrum dominance" is Washington's clearly stated aim.

Read the documents of the US Space Command, which leaves us in no doubt.

In this country, the eager Blair government has embarked on four violent adventures, in pursuit of "British interests" (dressed up as "peacekeeping"), and which have little or no basis in international law: a record matched by no other British government for half a century.

What has this to do with this week's atrocities in America? If you travel among the impoverished majority of humanity, you understand that it has everything to do with it.

People are neither still, nor stupid. They see their independence compromised, their resources and land and the lives of their children taken away, and their accusing fingers increasingly point north: to the great enclaves of plunder and privilege. Inevitably, terror breeds terror and more fanaticism.

But how patient the oppressed have been.

It is only a few years ago that the Islamic fundamentalist groups, willing to blow themselves up in Israel and New York, were formed, and only after Israel and the US had rejected outright the hope of a Palestinian state, and justice for a people scarred by imperialism.

Their distant voices of rage are now heard; the daily horrors in faraway brutalised places have at last come home.

John Pilger is an award-winning, campaigning journalist.

September 13, 2001

MarekReach The Sky

In this newsgroup nobody cares about different perspectives, award-winning journalists and reality. The perspective drawn by US media is the only one counting and everything else is "blasphemy". Unfortunately..... mfg Marek

The RackMarek

"Marek" wrote in message news:9o211r$psa$03$[email]...

In something like this, you need ultimate truth. Truth exists, that which is put into our hearts by God. Posts that try to describe America as a land that deserves to be punished by outside interests has no ring of truth to it.

Chadderack
Reach The SkyThe Rack

"The Rack" a �crit dans le message de news: fk6p7.2186$[email]...

award-winning

one

is

I don't want Marek to agree with that post since he sees things from only one side, but Rack, did you read the damn thing ?

The RackReach The Sky

"Reach The Sky" wrote in message news:Bo9p7.2902$[email]...

dans

which

to

Oh, yes.

Chadderack
Reach The SkyThe Rack

"The Rack" a �crit dans le message de news: fk6p7.2186$[email]...

award-winning

one

is

also, it's much easier to analyse objectively things like this when you're an atheist

The RackReach The Sky

"Reach The Sky" wrote in message news:_p9p7.2904$[email]...

That is an unsupported argument.

Chadderack
Reach The SkyThe Rack

"The Rack" a �crit dans le message de news: wnqp7.4091$[email]...

you're

I thought it was so simple it didn't need to be explained but...if you aren't a muslim or a christian or believing in anything that doesn't make sense, you see that attack a lot more rationaly, this attack was fueled by hatred of another religion, and religion blinds people totally, if you follow any religion straight from the book you don't care about people dying that do not believe in your god, if everyone followed any religious book at 100% this world would be total warfare everyday, where things like this happens to anyone from any culture or area, just read the Coran or Torah or even the Old Testament and imagine if everything from those books was applied every day, and you'll understand. The New Testament is in a different category, it sure is a good book with good things in it, but what actual christian in today's life actually applies everything from it ? especially not W Bush with his revenge promises

The RackReach The Sky

"Reach The Sky" wrote in message news:0Edq7.21277$[email]...

you're

Before I get to the rest of your statement... The statement you make is literally unsupported by argument. You made a statement without explaining it. Not everyone shares your opinion, so an explanation is needed.

doesn't make

There's a hidden opinion right there... "Religions don't make sense". (Just pointing that out)

My contention is that killing innocent civilians is NEVER justified, _especially_ by a group of apparently "religious" people.

Another opinion. Some people feel enlightened.

people dying

Says who? The simplest commandment from the New Testament, for example, is "Love one another" (from Jesus). Clearly if you love your fellow man, you do not kill him. You sorrow for those who die. You mourn with those who mourn.

warfare everyday

Totally wrong. This statement is supported later in the post.

read the Coran or Torah or

Absolutely not. The Old Testament's "Exodus" includes a very direct commandment "Thou shalt not kill". You seem to ascribe more intelligence or insight to these terrorists, because they follow their religion more closely than the peaceful people. I don't see that. The difference I see is a desire to impose someone's beliefs on another. This desire supercedes all, including rules that say "you must not kill". What makes the fanatacism "evil" is the desire to forcefully impose an ideal. It's that simple.

good things in it, but

?

Totally refuted by his excellent speech tonight. There wasn't a word of "revenge" in it.

Chadderack
Reach The SkyThe Rack

"The Rack" a �crit dans le message de news: CHxq7.3732$[email]...

meh, stop nitpicking everything I say and read it completly before saying such crap

(Just

it's explained later

Killing people to make a point often made a difference in our world, when the USA killed germans in WWII, it was because they believed they were evil, same with the muslims attacking the USA.

People in sects also feel enlightened....

do

mourn.

I said the New Testament isn't quite the same as other books, but still, it tells stuff that doesn't apply in real life and ignores people's emotions. "turning the other cheek" is for the weak who can't stand up for himself.

the church also always told the poor that they are blessed and they shouldn't want to change a thing, which gives a reason for the rich (and for the church before too) to exploit them even more

total

ok, according to the Torah, "a jew who wants to do evil, but doesn't want people to know that he did itt, should visit another town and do it there" I can't quote it directly, but just browse the internet and you'll see, there are tons of weird and evil stuff like that in much any religious book

and what about one of the coran's first line that says to eliminate your infidel neighbor ?

or

closely

desire

Read the old testament correctly and you'll see there are lot of stuff that god says that promotes pedophilia, murder of people who is different, incest, I can't post them all here, just browse for bible criticism web sites and you'll see. Sure it says Thou shalt not kill, but it also says stuff contradicting it. to be on topic even ned flanders says he obeys stuff that contradicts itself

with

it

sure there wasn't but, since when are politicians telling us the truth ? that's not directed only to republicans...(duh)

Gene Poole, cubed.Reach The Sky

-From the Tao Te Ching-

{31} Weapons at best are tools of bad omen ...

          Weapons at best are tools of bad omen,
          Loathed and avoided by those of the Way.
          In the usage of men of good breeding,
          Honor is had at the left;
          Good omens belong on the left
          Bad omens belong on the right;
          And warriors press to the right!
          When the general stands at the right
          His lieutenant is placed at the left.
          So the usage of men of great power
          Follows that of the funeral rite.
          Weapons are tools of bad omen,
          By gentlemen not to be used;
          But when it cannot be avoided,
          They use them with calm and restraint.
          Even in victory's hour
          These tools are unlovely to see;
          For those who admire them truly
          Are men who in murder delight.
          As for those who delight to do murder,
          It is certain they never can get
          From the world what they sought when ambition
          Urged them to power and rule.
          A multitude slain!- and their death
          Is a matter for grief and for tears;
          The victory after a conflict
          Is a theme for a funeral rite.

HTH

Gene Poole � To reply, e-mail to poolespam AT yahoo.com If you reply to the e-mail address above, it better be something flameworthy. Hi, I'm not a signature virus. Why don't you just copy me into your
AngelMarek

It's people who believe this comment are the danger to the "civilised" world... Yes what happened last Tuesday was unforgivable however far worse things have happen to other cultures around the world and unfortunately some of these have been carried out by the likes of the USA and UK governments.

At the moment, tension is still high and therefore peoples outlooks become clouded... Why else do people suddenly start taking their anger out on a religion and not use this energy to help the families and friends of those that have suffered... Instead of attacking a Muslim, go to New York and make drinks for the rescue teams !!

"Marek" wrote in message news:9o211r$psa$03$[email]...

The RackAngel

"Angel" wrote in message news:9o3d2r$jk1$[email]...

worse

some

I'm not responding to further trolls. Good day.

Chadderack
Reach The SkyThe Rack

"The Rack" a �crit dans le message de news: goqp7.14031$[email]...

governments.

trolls...heh, anyone who disagrees with you is a troll, you should read your Usenet FAQ again

The RackReach The Sky

"Reach The Sky" wrote in message news:OXyp7.12073$[email]...

dans

unfortunately

your

Those who try to continually stir people up and make them angry are called "trollers". Notice I haven't become angry at you. We disagree. Big deal. The fact is thousands are dead. However that sits with you is what really matters.

Chadderack
AngelThe Rack

The

The comments I made aren't meant just to "stir people up"... They are statements of truth.

If you look at the other post's I have made there is a common theme... My heart goes out to ALL of the family and friends of everyone involved in the Twin Tower disaster and hope that the guilty parties are dealt with quickly and harshly BUT if you read the other posts then you will see that most of them show the USA in the role of world policeman who have never hurt anyone... This is simply untrue.

The USA like ALL countries have at sometime or another provided weapons and support purely for political purposes to terroists / countries that have then used them to kill innocent people....

Most of the reactions shortly after the bommbing we're bent on starting the third world war... This isn't what needs to happen....

I have no problem if we disagree to this, but don't just start posting to dismiss others views because YOU don't agree with them!!

The RackAngel

"Angel" wrote in message news:9o86j1$a8o$[email]...

called

The

Huh? I was talking to "Reach the Sky"... unless he is you.

the

quickly

and

That is an interpretation of the facts, I admit.

the

In a certain perspective, it already has begun. Should we shrug off the attack because we're ashamed of having pissed off some radical asshole terrorists? Should we just let it go because it's time to "take our medicine", only to be attacked again? Who is going to stop those people? These are the questions we should be asking and answering; we shouldn't be worried about how ashamed the U.S. citizens should feel of their government, or one person's deranged interpretation of past events. There is simply NO call for such a terrorist act against innocent people, regardless of any past perceived wrongdoing by a government.

Heh. Nice. You just contradicted yourself. "Don't just start posting to dismiss others views because YOU don't agree with them". That's what USENET is all about, my friend.

Chadderack
Reach The SkyThe Rack

"The Rack" a �crit dans le message de news: _0Tp7.7126$[email]...

deal.

My

of

government,

to

USENET

look at the properties of a message before saying me and that guy are the same person

NNTP-Posting-Host: host62-7-27-243.btinternet.com = england (angel)

NNTP-Posting-Host: 64.229.233.117 = that's a canadian IP range (me)

The RackReach The Sky

"Reach The Sky" wrote in message news:6LVp7.17662$[email]...

I had, but the original response was to you. He chose to answer as if I was talking to him.

I promise to limit these OT posts (responses, mostly) and I'll try to remain on topic... though it seems pretty trivial at this moment.

One final point: The original post by Reach The Sky had some factual information, and indicated s/he had done his/her homework before posting. The raw information is unrefuted. I couldn't overcome the implication, however, that we were meant to boil everything off down to a theme... "America herself is somewhat responsible for the attacks". That is the meat of what I disagree with. There is no justification, ever, for the mass murder of innocent people. Never. That is a moral absolute. There are no exceptions. If that is the case, 100% of the blame for the attacks go to the perpetrators. If we are to infer that everything listed in the original post were examples of America pissing off some Islamic radicals, then I think it is easy to conclude that the perpetrators get all of the blame. Killing innocent people, even though you've been shunned and looked down upon (if only in your perception) by a country until you are enraged, is NEVER a solution. It is NEVER justified.

Chadderack
Philip WernerReach The Sky

Is there a word for someone who goes against popular opinion just for the sake of it?