TV Guide Lists Top 50 Animated Characters

What was the criterion for this "list"?

"Steve Mindykowski" wrote in message news:[email]...

Ear size?

"Diamondback" wrote in message news:j8n09.4056$[email]...

"Diamondback" wrote in message news:j8n09.4056$[email]...

The "criterion" was what made up opinions would sell more *collector* cover issues.

"Diamondback" wrote:

Probably the same criterion that you used when deciding to top quote a one hundred sixteen line message when asking a question that only adds a single useful line.

"Diamondback" wrote in message news:j8n09.4056$[email]...

One thing is obvious when such classic characters as Mickey Mouse, Daffy Duck, Donald Duck, and Porky Pig are ranked below characters like Angelica Pickles, SpongeBob SquarePants, and the Powerpuff Girls...

...then it means that whatever criteria was used, simple "common sense" wasn't one of them.

In article , "Zagone" wrote:

Neither was reality it seems when you have characters that you go 'Who' ranked above the all time oldies.

"Diamondback" wrote in message news:j8n09.4056$[email]...

Good question. I'm puzzled over the omission of the Animaniacs, Pinky and the Brain, and Dexter and DeeDee.

On Sat, 27 Jul 2002 11:51:59 -0400, "recook77" would have gotten away with it, if not for those meddling kids :

And Aquaman...

Kidding, kidding.

turner

On Sat, 27 Jul 2002 01:59:43 GMT, "Diamondback" wrote:

Darts, it seems.

Hw�t! We have heard of the glory of [email] (Bing) that wrote news:[email], on the day of 29 Jul 2002:

That was my first thought, as well, but on further reflection I concluded that the TV Guide editors probably aren't allowed to play with sharp, pointy things. I'm thinking they did "One Potato, Two Potato." (Roshambo is a little too complicated...)

-Mark Steese

Steve Mindykowski forked over the usual $0.00023 cents while saying:

I agree with that. Bugs is the king.

no way in hell

A little too low. He was (basically) the first (animated anyway)

too low

again, no way in hell...put Tom and Jerry at No. 4 and B&B much further down, then maybe we have something

Terwilliger writes:

Not even close. He wasn't even the first sound cartoon.

"Joseph Nebus" wrote in message news:[email]...

Speaking of Mickey, are his cartoons even shown on TV nowadays? I know Cartoon Network doesn't show them, and I don't even think the Disney Channel airs them (at least not that much).

In article ,

Gertie, Koko the Clown, and Felix the Cat are just a few of many cartoon characters that were popular before Mickey Mouse was created.

"The Ink and Paint Club" everyday at 4AM Eastern time on the Disney Channel, and "Donald's Quack Attack" at Midnight on Toon Disney. Especially watch for the black and white cartoons of the early 30's. Those Mickey cartoons were excellent. On those cartoons alone I think Mickey deserves a higher rank, though I'd rank Donald Duck and Goofy higher over him. There's also some recent Mickey shorts done on the "House of Mouse" TV cartoon.

[email] (Joseph Nebus) forked over the usual $0.00023 cents while saying:

Not even close? Who was the first? And, how many days removed from Mickey's first was it?

Terwilliger writes:

The earliest commercial sound cartoons of which I'm aware were developed by Max Fleischer and Dr. Lee DeForest -- the Bouncing Ball (as in, follow-the-) and Song Car-Tunes. Leonard Maltin's book ("Of Mice and Magic") credits the first of those ("My Old Kentucky Home") as being released four years before "Steamboat Willie," but then lists in the back (he lists all the major studios' releases, an indispensible resource) just two years separating them.

There was a nice videotape a few years back ("Fleischer Madness," or something like that -- luckily for those of us with weak memories, it's the one Leonard Maltin hosts) that contains a brief clip, with faint audio, of "My Old Kentucky Home."

Joseph Nebus wrote in message news:ai547n$[email]...

I agree with you about the Maltin book. It is an indespensible work on animation studios, including outfits like the Ub Iwerks and Van Buren studios. I really hopes that Maltin finds some time away from his other projects to come up with an updated edition. However with all due respect there is a difference between a "follow the bouncing ball" cartoon and a cartoon in which the character speaks or sings and in which the sound effects and music are synchronised with the actions of the character -- including playing farm animals like musical instruments. As Maltin himself points out animated cartoons were a dying novelty by the time that sound arrived as a commercially viable property, and I think it can be argued quite successfully that Disney was the first to really grasp how to use it effectively.

I'd like to see that.

In article , [email] wrote:

B&B were SO over in their third season.

Way too high.

"Ubiquitous" wrote in message news:be819.347553$[email]...

I agree.

The fact that there are seven characters ranked above this makes me want to vomit. But then, all of TV Guide's "lists" induce that reaction.

n.

"Steve Mindykowski" wrote in message news:[email]...

ALL TIME

One problem I have with the list...Bugs was created for the movies...not TV. With the publication being called "TV" Guide, the list should have been for characters created especially for TV....not characters that were eventually shown on TV, like Bugs and Daffy (and hey, don't get me wrong....I love 'em both).

Brian

On Sat, 27 Jul 2002 13:04:16 GMT, "Brian in VA" wrote:

TV Guide in recent years has abandoned any pretense about being a TV magazine. They are now the magazine of "whatever entertainment phenomenon will sell the most covers this week".

Hell, their "TV Listings" don't even cover half the stations I get on cable.

Brian

wheres Hammerman?

"Steve Mindykowski" wrote in message news:[email]...

I guess for long time achievment.

And now the good stuff.

Bullwinkle yes, Rocky no

These two are okay together

At least the cartoon

I like both but why together?

Cool

Snoopy yes, Charlie Brown no

Number 9?? God help us

Kick ass!

Bart yes, Lisa is fine but not for a top list

Okay

Good

Not too dispicable

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHH!

Pokey is better

Why?

Don't like him

Donald should be above him

Bluto is better

What?

Can you say "old"?

Okay, I guess

Okay too,

Some nerve

YUCK! Too squishy

Oh great, now I want some "hunny"

Hmmmmmmmm...

See "Heckle and Jeckle"

STUPID! STUPID! STUPID!

Okay, good together

How terrific, who is he anyway?

Should be higher on the list

Just because the song is catchy and the character is played by Ray Charles doesn't make him any better.

Funny more than courageous

Yogi yes, Boo Boo no (by the way, I have an idea for a parody involving fat bears)

Why?

Move them up, they are better than what I have seen so far!

The current better animated one, right?

See "Superman"

I kind of liked that show

I never seen her other than Superfriends

Best disney character ever! Deserves better than 43

60's or 80's?

Better than Rocky and Bullwinkle

Annoying

Also Annoying

I know better

Oh come on, Pikachu out ranks him? Sad, verrry sad

Okay, could be higher

In article , [email] (Jack Of Spades) said:

'Cause she's *hot*.

[email] (Jack Of Spades) wrote in news:[email]:

Although his made-for-TV specials sucked.

And I think 'Do America' can be considered a classic. :)

Agreed.

*Slams her 50 times with a mallet*

I *hate* that kid. (although she does have her flaws)

Almost as much as Nick from WishKid and Gadget Boy.

Mind you, how do you think they'd fare against Monkey from 'Dial M'?

Ever the persitant and relatable underdog.

It could be worse, I could have written a parody called 'Porky-mon' with an even 'cuter' critter.

Agreed!

That's what I'm wondering.

And overused on some stations but it was still a good cartoon for it's time.

For the first season and a half, definitely.

Their 'mystery' show not withstanding. }:)

A nostlagia powered by Cocoa Puffs?

Particularly when you ponder the Wile E. Coyote question.

Actually the Fleisher and 'CBS' versions also have their merits.

CBS in particular.

If you mean Batman Beyond then, again, the other (Warner produced) series also have their merits. The movies, however, are another story.

Did anyone notice the plot hole in Phantasm, for example?

I would have thought she'd make the top ten.

She's been in an episode of the 'CBS' Superman.

IIRC, they teamed up to fight some evil sorceress that was taking over Metropolis. (You'd think the citizens would be used to it by now.)

Agreed.

Do you get the feeling we should compile our own list?

Signed, Warewolf at Large

Tom & Jerry at 50? Those people must be retarded! I agree about Bugs though. Acme cartoons rock!

The old Disney cartoons were cool too.

If Beavis & Butthead is on there, why isn't Rocko, from Rocko's Modern Life on there?

What about Snow White? Cinderella? Bambi? Peter Pan? Lady and the Tramp? Beauty and the Beast? Lion King? Etc...

(Before you say "They weren't made for TV", neither were Bugs, Mickey Mouse and Popeye)

Only Pikachu and Speed Racer from outside the US? Where's Tin Tin, Asterix and Obelix or Lucky Luke? Or, while I personally can't stand them, The Smurfs?

Or Battle of the Planets, Voltron, Gigantor or

ASTROBOY!

Let alone modern Anime... (Akira? Ghost in the Shell? My Neighbour Totoro? Princess Mononoke? Ranma 1/2? etc, etc...)

What about:

Aeon Flux Duckman Droopy Dog The Terrible Thunder Lizards Invader Zim Johnny Quest The Maxx Samurai Jack The Pink Panther Pinky and the Brain Simon and the Land of Chalk Drawings Spider-Man The Tick Rudolph the Red Nosed Reindeer Mr. Bill The Iron Giant The Jetsons Reboot Dexter and Mimi

Okay, a bunch of these may be disqualified by lack of popularity if that's a big part of the criteria rather than quality, but, Johnny Quest, The Pink Panther, Spider-Man, The Jetsons and Astroboy are all huge omissions!

Tom and Jerry and Popeye should be in the Top 10. So should Mickey Mouse. I'd also rank several like Porky and Woody quite a bit higher.

Beavis and Butt-Head, The Grinch, Fat Albert, Gumby and Top Cat are all ranked too high (Grinch should be top-20 but not top-5, the others should be 30-something maybe 40-something for Fat Albert and B&B) I love both Sponge Bob and the Powerpuff Girls but neither should be in the top-20 (Yet! Maybe after they have a larger body of work and have stood the test of time a little...)

Drop from the list: Alvin, Daria, Arthur, Pikachu, Josie, Angelica Pickles, Wonder Woman (Why is Wonder Woman on this list? For the Superfriends? Or the Current Justice League cartoon? I don't think so. Batman, Superman and Spider-Man have far better resumes. Hell, I'd rank The Hulk (Solid 80's cartoon) X-Men (Good 90's cartoon, okay recent cartoon) and The Tick (Brilliant!) ahead of Wonder Woman)

What about The Line (from the Dot and the Line?) Or the cat that came back? Or Godzilla and Bambi?

Wow, what a bad list!!

Well, at least they didn't include Jar Jar Binks! (But then, what about, say, the dinosaurs from Jurassic Park?)

Chris...

Lest we forget Marine Boy.

Oh! Yes, yes and more yes! Some wonderful viewing in that list... the four above bring back hours of great memories. The Maxx was brilliant, just brilliant. I want to watch it all right now... my friend has the "official" tapes somewhere...

The Cat That Came Back is wonderful classic NFB film. These are so hard to find, though...

fishy wrote:

You really should give Aeon Flux a try (and the vastly under-rated Phantom 2040). Completely different, but a very compatible feel.

Not really, try www.nfb.ca or more specifically:

http://www.nfb.ca/nfbstore/ibeCCtpItmDspRte.jsp?a=b&formatid=17537

Chris...

How is Spongebob 9?  As much as I like the show, it isn't better than Tom and
Jerry or Mickey Mouse.
________________________________________________________________

If love of money is the root of all evil, why do churches want it so badly?

Remove "bination" to reply.

Can't believe I didn't think to mention: TRANSFORMERS!

Chris...

"Christopher Tumber" wrote:

TV Guide also omitted characters from GI Joe and ReBoot.

Hw�t! We have heard of the glory of Exatron that wrote news:[email], on the day of 27 Jul 2002:

If they were going to include cartoon characters based on toys, they would also have to include...Skeletor!

(He-Man never had any personality to speak of, but Skeletor should have been included on the basis of his fashion sense alone...)

-Mark Steese

Hw�t! We have heard of the glory of [email] (Christopher Tumber) that wrote news:3d43531e.26345247 @nntp.slnt.phub.net.cable.rogers.com, on the day of 27 Jul 2002:

Yes, but most of them aren't really cartoon characters, just fictional characters who happen to have cartoon adaptations. Disney's Beauty and the Beast pale next to Cocteau's live-action adaptation, and Peter Pan was both a book and a play long before Disney got ahold of it. (Of the list above, only the Lion King is an original character (albeit a Japanese one, originally).)

Tintin, Asterix and Lucky Luke are all better-known for their original comic book appearances; none of them is really a classic *animated* character. And the Smurfs were also originally comic-book characters (and plastic toys) long before the abominable cartoons were made.

The editors of TV Guide would have Porygonesque seizures if they were required to watch anime, let alone try to pick out specific characters.

Evidently not, since Gerald McBoing-Boing, Tom Terrific and (of all ridiculous things) "The Bill" from Schoolhouse Rock made the cut.

The Pink Panther is well-known, but not especially memorable *as a character.*

I wouldn't put Tom and Jerry on a list of great animated characters, since they have no real personality traits -- they're just there to hang gags on. Popeye's a tough call -- the great Fleischer cartoons have to be weighed against the awful post-Fleischer stuff.

I'd put Elmer Fudd on the list rather than Porky. (Goodness gwacious, the wascals weft him off the wist!) If they could include Boris & Natasha they could sure as hell include Elmer. For that matter, there was no point in putting Space Ghost on the list and leaving out Zorak, Moltar, and Brak.

Gladly.

Don't even *think* about dropping Daria. Not only is she a great character, she's one of the few characters on the list who was originally created as a television cartoon. (Of course, it should be "Daria and Jane."

I agree with all those. (If they're going to include anyone from Pok�mon it's got to be the Roketto-Dan. Nyante nya!)

They could also easily drop the Road Runner - Wile E. is arguably a great character, but the Road Runner? Winnie the Pooh should be dropped -- great children's book character, crap animated character. I'd also drop Superman and Batman, since they're really comic book characters, not animated characters, and put Letterman (from "The Electric Company") in their place. He was a character created specifically for TV, and he was much cooler, not least because no one has ever used the word "mythic" to describe him.

-Mark Steese

Mark Steese wrote:

I might agree with this, except for the purpose of this list characters adapted from other media were definately NOT excluded, for example: The Grinch, Charlie Brown and Snoopy, Pooh, Superman, Batman, Wonder Woman, Alvin (Pikachu? Not sure what came first, the cartoon? The video game? The card game?)

While I might agree with the merits of putting together a list made up exclusively of characters originating in cartoons, that's not what TV Guide did. So at least some of the character's from Disney feature length films should be on this list as should Tin Tin, Asterix and Obelix, Lucky Luke and The Smurfs.

I wrote:

Mark replied:

Good point!

Granted the Panther's no Bugs Bunny, but I'm sure everyone reading this can rank The Pink Panther ahead of at least 10 characters who did make the list...

They have a fairly large body of work that's very well known and very influential.

Which reminds me, where's Itchy and Scratchy? They really should have just tacked "The Simpsons" at #2 instead of splitting off Bart, Lisa and Homer. The show has so many great characters and they didn't split off, say The Powerpuff Girls into Blosom, Buttercup and Bubbles and since they just listed the title of the show I'm not ragging on them for omitting Mojo Jojo as I'm considering him included at #13.

Same for Rocky and Bullwinkle and Boris and Natasha. Would also free up a few spots for some of the characters which they overlooked (I sure hope they didn't do it to pad out the list because they ran out of ideas....)

Well, then what about the post-John K Ren and Stimpy's? Or Batman's uneven cartoon carer?

That Marlon Brando and Orson Welles went to seed doesn't diminish their earlier careers....

I have nothing against Daria, but I wouldn't put her in the top-50 for the same reason I wouldn't put Sponge Bob or The Powerpuff Girls in the Top-20. Not enough historial perspective yet.

The tv series has moments of real brilliance and is exceptional throughout. I'd say it's the best Disney has produced in the last 20 years (including features).

Check out "The Wishing Bear", "Donkey For A Day", "The Piglet Who Would Be King" or "Find Her, Keep Her".

Disney also makes more money from Pooh than Mickey Mouse. That has to count for something...

See above, you also have to drop The Grinch, Charlie Brown and Snoopy, etc.

Batman deserves to be here for the 90's tv series. Superman for the Fleischer cartoons.

Still don't understand how Wonder Woman makes the list and not Spidey for the classic Bakshi series and the two more recent, solid, efforts.

Chris...

Hw�t! We have heard of the glory of [email] (Christopher Tumber) that wrote news:[email], on the day of 28 Jul 2002:

The video game came first, in his case. Geek that I am, I actually went to the trouble of making a list of all the characters on the TV Guide list who originally appeared in other media - by my count 28 of the characters did.

Except that TV Guide didn't use any coherent criterion that I can see. It looks to me like they pulled names out of a hat. Hence my point about leaving off Elmer Fudd...their Number 1 character is Bugs Bunny and his most famous adversary doesn't even make the list? That makes no sense whatsoever.

Well, everyone but me. I'd dump a lot of characters from the list, but I can think of many characters I'd replace them with (like Elmer Fudd and Droopy) before I'd include the Panther. (Cool theme music, though.)

If being well-known was a main criterion, then sure, I'd put 'em on the list, but I was thinking more of characters who are great in and of themselves. Tom and Jerry needed a big budget to be funny; the later, cheaper cartoons are so bad they're painful. (Though I'll never understand why Chuck Jones gets so much grief while Gene Deitch's deranged Eastern-European style Tom and Jerrys are ignored. Oh, yeah, put Tom and Jerry in a 'Moby Dick' parody. *That'll* work...)

Good characters can work on the cheap: Tex Avery was able to make funny Droopy cartoons on a greatly-reduced budget, and "The Adventures of Rocky and Bullwinkle" was cheap from the word go.

I agree with that, but pointless splitting of some groups but not others is a recurring theme on the list -- thus we get Josie and the Pussycats but not Alvin and the Chipmunks, Yogi and Boo-Boo but not Gumby and Pokey. I'm beginning to wonder if I didn't give them too much credit in assuming they were organized enough to pull names out of a hat.

Urgh! Good point, I'd blocked the memory of those from my mind. Those rival the Deitch Tom and Jerrys for sheer badness.

At least the Superfriends cartoons were funny, albeit unintentionally. ("Use the Bat-Lube, Robin!")

Hmm...I don't know if I'd agree with that. I have more respect for an actor who had the sense to call it quits (like Cary Grant) than for one who should have packed it in long ago.

In any case, it's a bit different for fictional characters.

Ah, okay. It's just that I'm a major fan of the show. (You'd never have guessed, right?)

All right, I'll take your word for it. I didn't even know there was a TV series -- I was only familiar with the 60s adaptations.

[snip]

I'd be fine with that -- it's not like there's a shortage of characters that could take their places. (Where's Goofy? He's much funnier than Mickey Mouse!)

I agree, that makes no sense. Looks like someone panicked because there weren't enough female characters on the list. So what happened to She- Ra, Princess of Power? (They can try to ignore the 80s, but they can't make them go away...^_^)

-Mark Steese

[email] (Mark Steese) wrote in message news:...

Daria easily belongs amongst the top five _tv series_ of all time, not just animated.

Ryan

Where's Clutch Cargo?

Hw�t! We have heard of the glory of [email] (RemnantsAflame) that wrote news:[email], on the day of 31 Jul 2002:

I agree - the writing was consistently better, over a longer period, than that of any live-action show I can think of. The gradual development of the supporting characters over the show's run impresses me no end -- most shows can't even be bothered to develop the main characters. Daria reminds me of Calvin & Hobbes - they both started off good, got better and better, and ended on a high note (and I wish they were both still around!).

-Mark Steese

On Sun, 28 Jul 2002 02:23:00 GMT, [email] (Christopher Tumber) wrote:

These were feature films and are still shown as films/special presentations/etc. on TV channels (except didn't B&B get a series somewhere?).

The main difference I see, though, especially with the Warner Bros. characters, is that many people grew up seeing them as a regular fixture on TV (Saturday morning cartoon series), and even more are growing up seeing them as regular fixture shows (basically series) on Cartoon Network. I know this is drawing a fine line too, and not to be defining TVG, but I'd guess this is maybe the same one TV Guide used, perhaps (either that, or they too forgot the movie origins of the Warner Bros. shorts).

Seen little of most of these myself (though yes, I do wonder why Droopy is MIA).

Forgot about that one, but a worthy candidate.

I did not forget about this one; definitely MIA, IMO.

Never saw much of these (don't even know the first).

Was this a regular show, or a one-shot movie?

????

Good movie, but was only a movie (AFAIK), thus on the wrong side of TVG's fine line.

Oh, heck, forgot about them too, but would have to pick one (or two) character, to fit the seeming pattern of the list.

Not familiar with.

What is this? I keep thinking it was a single cartoon, something to the effect of a Line trying to show off to a "female" character, or two lines, one that showed off well and the other only able to make "himself" look tangled.

I wrote:

D.Welle wrote:

As with other objections raised (ie: not originating in cartoons) there are enough examples that DID make the list to nullify this as a criteria for leaving these examples out.

While you might want to make a list that excludes movies or one-shot appearances TV guide did not do so in other examples.

I wrote:

D.Welle wrote

Jonny Quest is arguably the best American adventure cartoon of the 60's. The others are all modern classics...

Simon was a mainstay of Captain Kangaroo though it was originally a British series with the narration replaced by Bob (Captain Kangaroo) Keeshan for the US.

The Bakshi Spider-Man cartoon alone should make Spidey a shoe in, plus there've been two more decent series since.

On Sun, 28 Jul 2002 16:39:42 GMT, [email] (Christopher Tumber) wrote:

Well, I don't think I raised the "not originating in cartoons" one -- or we'd have to exclude The Simpsons at very least! :-)

Yes, the more I look at the list to figure out TV Guide's criteria, the fuzzier it gets, but maybe a look back at the first several paragraphs (before the list) in the original quotation (the originating post of this thread) is more revealing.

Funny thing is, another note in this thread indicated another item on this list was a component of Capt. Kangaroo, but I can remember none of the subcomponents, just the Capt.; maybe I saw less of this show than I thought I had.

Ah, yes, I remember that now, and in fact just saw it again within the last few years (just wasn't remembering the details). It was very clever, and I liked the message too. Thanks for the detail.

Ohhh, *The* Bill from Schoolhouse Rock. The original post just said "Bill from Schoolhouse Rock," and it just didn't click who that was without the "The." I see your point now.

Agreed. I wasn't looking for quantity, but trying to figure out TV Guide's criteria (yeah, probably a fruitless pursuit).

D.Welle wrote:

Yeh, it was another poster in another thread but it's a similar argument and I was trying to tie it together so I'm not making the same point over and over....

Well, all it really has to say is:

In its August 3 issue (on newsstands Monday, July 29), TV Guide� magazine continues the 50th anniversary celebration of the TV Guide brand by naming the 50 greatest cartoon characters of all time.

The rest is just advertising. This crtiteria seems pretty inclusive, including film, television or anything else, "foreign" and domestic, recurring or unique.

Memory is a funny thing. I'd completely forgotten about Starcade until someone showed me an episode last week and I remembered how much I loved that show as a kid (uh, teen)....

You might remember it if you see it. It's pretty disctinctive...

I really get the feeling it was put together by one guy and not "The Editors" which would explain the oversights and some of the idiosyncratic selections (Gerald McBoing Boing; Beavis and Butthead near the top; Tom and Jerry just squeaking in, inconsistant groupings, etc...)

Chris...

Hw�t! We have heard of the glory of D.Welle that wrote news:[email], on the day of 28 Jul 2002:

[snippage]

But The Simpsons *did* originate in cartoons...Matt Groening specifically created them to be animated for filler material on the Tracey Ullman show. ISTR that James Brooks originally suggested they animate the "Life in Hell" characters but Groening came up with new ones to avoid having to tone down his old ones.

-Mark Steese

In alt.tv.simpsons, on the "Re: TV Guide Lists Top 50 Animated Characters" thread, D.Welle wrote:

Eh? James Brooks approached Matt Groening about using characters from his "Life in Hell" comic strip as animated "bumpers" for "The Tracey Ullman Show." Groening wasn't too keen on selling any of the rights to his characters, especially to TV executives, so he hit upon the idea of creating new characters -- the Simpsons family -- especially for television. "The Simpsons" is about as pure as an example of "originating in cartoons" as you can get, in that the show came first, and their appearance in all other media followed.

In article , [email] (Benjamin Robinson) wrote:

Tenchi Muyo is another example - it has been so wildly succesfull in Japan that there are 13 different continuities scatter over 4 seperate 'main realities'. One would be hard pressed to find any other series that has don that (Though Star Trek comes close)

In article , Bruce Grubb wrote:

Though not all versions are animated, Batman comes to mind.

In article , [email] (Bill Steele) wrote:

But were were talking about series that 'originated in cartoons' which since Batman existed first as a comic leaves Batman out. Even if one counted Batman in his various TV incarnatoin the variation is not as great as Tenchi Muyo for in all the incarnations the general details are the same in regards to Batman. In the Pretty Sammy continuity Tenchi is NOT the Tenchi in the other series - he, Aeka, and Ryoko have no alien aspects to them and the focues is on Sasami. Only in the comics has Batman even come close to this.

Three important ones which I haven't seen mentioned in this thread -

"Sealab: 2020" - realistic animation, fantastic Alex Toth scenic designs, and realistic (for a cartoon) scripts.

"Star Trek: The Animated Series" - yes the current "Star Trek" franchise is trying to deny that this ever existed, but it did exist. The animation was about as horrible as limited animation could be, the voices sounded stunted because the cast only recorded their voices together for one show, and some of the scripts were pretty absurd. But - there were also several fantastic scripts which would have done the live series proud, they at least did use the original voices, it was true to the original series (no kids taking over the bridge), and was - at least at the time - a significant portion of "Star Trek"'s early history. Unlike the many other late 60s 70s TV shows which transitioned to cartoons (Gilligan's Island, Partridge Family, Brady Kids, etc.) they played it straight - as if it was another season of the original series.

"Tiny Toons" - who could think that younger versions of the classic famous Warner Brothers characters could be as funny, quick witted, and as well written for both adults and kids? With plenty of inside jokes about the fact that Steven Spielberg was the Executive Producer, and lots of jokes which you've got to watch again as an adult to really appreciate.

And to remphasize ones which others have mentioned -

"Jonny Quest" (the original version) - a fantastic realistic prime time animated show. The remake wasn't so hot, but it had some memorable moments.

"Garfield" - one of the handful of shows too good for kids (like Bullwinkle & Rocky, Animaniacs, and some Bugs Bunny cartoons.) My favorite line - Garfield to some health nut who took away the stove and microwave "I'll give you an hour to return the stove and a minute to return the microwave!" or they're walking down the hallway of a haunted house and the ghoul says "Walk this way" and Garfield walks across the screen saying "Nah, we aren't going to do that old gag."

"Animaniacs" and "Pinky and the Brain" for the same reasons as "Tiny Toons" And a special nod to the "Animaniacs" episode where they make fun of Internet geeks who notice all of the little things the writers and animators put in to the episodes and even compile lists of those tidbits.

All truly major omissions from TV Guide's rather arbitary lists.

Philip Chien, KC4YER (at) amsat.org

There are three kinds of people that no one understands. Geniuses, madmen, and guys that mumble.

Philip Chien wrote in message news:...

Uh... what?! Realistic? No. Not Twisted Tales of Felix the Cat, but not exactly Downtown, either.

You mean, stilted?

I gotta find these shows on tape. Not suitable for the toon list, I'd say. By that rationale, Phantom should made the \list, due to the strength of Phantom 2040. Batman and Superman are two of the strongest, however. X-Men shoulda been on the list, on the basis of the Saban series.

Yeah, I never thought I'd say "strong" and "Saban" in the same sentence.

I think each of the three versions should stand on their own.

There's a "Find the Mistake" short that's an absolute classic. Gotta set the VCR for that one.

I'd say our lists are just as arbitrary. That's why I don't make these lists. Best and Worst of the Year lists, I'll do! :)

Terrence Briggs, who doesn't figure any measure of popularity and nostalgia would give The Maxx it's due Peace to you...

In alt.tv.simpsons, on the "Re: TV Guide Lists Top 50 Animated Characters" thread, Philip Chien wrote:

Wow, there are people who actually do that? I am shocked. Shocked, I tell you!

[email] (Christopher Tumber) wrote in message news:...

I think your memory is misleading you. Mr. Bill was made of clay, but he wasn't animated. He never moved on camera by himself; he only moved between cuts. This even applied to his facial expressions (and of course he never moved his lips when he talked). Things happened to Mr Bill on camera (Mr Hands picks him up and puts him in the car, a rock falls on him, he is set on fire, etc.), but the little clay man was never animated.

ShadZ

[email] (Christopher Tumber) wrote in news:[email]:

Indeed.

I shall 'ever await the presenation of 'the Last Duckman Story'

[A 50-ton boulder crushes Scooter flat as a pancake]

[Finally the hurting stops]

Who?

Along with Mighty Orbots and the Bionic Six.

My only disagreement since the lines she and Jane spout are brilliantly timed and fitting for the situations they're used in.

Signed, Warewolf at Large

According to Christopher Tumber : :What about Snow White? Cinderella? Bambi? Peter Pan? Lady and the :Tramp? Beauty and the Beast? Lion King? Etc... : :(Before you say "They weren't made for TV", neither were Bugs, Mickey :Mouse and Popeye)

And don't say "Well, Snow White, etc. were only in one movie" because the Grinch is in the list.

As in all such ridiculous lists, without stating the criteria by which winners were selected, anyone could put together an alternative list.

But then, TV Guide doesn't care that you agree with them - only that you buy their product. So who cares about logic and reason.

i'm surprised that Angelica got picked instead of any of the other Rugrats.. and i think that Spongebob should have got a higher place in the list, or at least a higher place than Angelica

~Stewart :)

My Nickelodeon TV, Nicktoons, Classic Nick, Nickelodeon UK & AU, Nick At Nite message board - http://bb.bbboy.net/nickdisk (Now with an added Nick shows & Nicktoons characters RPG)

Steve Mindykowski wrote in message news:...

As others have mentioned, this list is confusing, to say the least. I love Charlie Brown, Snoopy, and Batman, and some of the animated shows involving these characters are among the best, IMHO. But still, they are not "created" primarily as animated characters. The same rule applied for best original song in Oscar : if the song was not written primarily for the movie, it does not qualify for Oscar nomination.

Sorry for the cross-posting, if that anyones you.

It's all rather subjective all around, but that said...

Definitely #1.

Maybe not #2, but definitely top 10.

Seen little of, can't comment.

Funny for short stretches, but I can't believe #4 is soiled by their presence. I can see top 50, but not top 20, much less 4th.

Though animated and a character, unlike most of the names I recognize, wasn't this one a one-shot character? Still, probably top 20, but not 5th.

I don't like the inconsistency of this list as a whole: listing some characters separately of their counterparts, and some together (more comment on that in #11 below). That said, good ranking.

I don't know of this one.

Okay, I can accept that.

Can't really comment.

Sounds good.

Okay, separate Homer, then combine Bart and Lisa? The list can't even stay consistent regarding one fictional family. TV Guide would have best left pairings for characters where the cartoon was 80+% those two characters (e.g. Tom and Jerry, Road Runner and Coyote, B&BH), not family groupings.

Saw too long ago or too little, respectively, to comment.

About right, or maybe should be a little higher.

Pretty high for an annoying squeekball, but maybe that's just me.

Saw little of these shows too comment much, other than knowing I simply cannot get past the way-wide faces the latter and the Rugrats (?) have, even knowing perfectly well that cartoon faces are obviously not meant to be literal.

Don't know this one

A little suprised this isn't a little higher

Okay, I can accept that, even though I never much cared for the cartoon.

Who?

Same reaction as #20

????

Never saw

Okay, top 50 maybe, not 25

????

Been ages, but okay.

Saw little or nothing of these.

Waaayyy too gross for me to stand

????

Good ranking

Don't really remember this any more

Okay

Should be higher in the list

Vaguely remember the name, but can't place it. MTV?

Never really saw the cartoon version.

Should be higher, ~25 maybe.

Never liked this cartoon myself.

Okay

Haven't seen much of this show

Seen too little of to comment.

Okay.

Where are Pinky and the Brain? Jay Sherman (The Critic) maybe should have been here too, but perhaps only in the 40s. And come on, how could a top 50 list not have Bender (Futurama), who should not only be listed, but top 20, or at least top 30, IMO.

As much as they annoyed me even as a child, I'm surprised The Smurfs aren't listed (or did no one Smurf or two Smurf characters stand out from the others?).

Unless I missed something, it appears none of the characters from product-first-cartoon-second shows appeared (maybe for good reason, though I remember liking the original Transformers).

There's probably more from the Warner Bros. stable, or elsewhere, that I'm forgetting.

In article , D.Welle wrote:

Come to think of it, where are *any* of the Animaniacs? Surely a show made for TV, and surely important enough to have spawned a prime-time animated show (P&tB), and stop calling me Shirley.

Dave

Yes, Bender from Futurama deserves a place.

"D.Welle" wrote in message news:[email]...

In article , "Ol' Kentucky Shark" writes:

Yeah, Bender's a genius!

This things mean naothinga nd are really just a publicity stunt but I few comments come to mind: 1. there are more than 50 characters in the list since some numbers have two characters listed, 2) Yogi Bear should be much higher in the list, perhaps even second after Bugs Bunny, 3) some of the characters in the list do not deserve to be there (Cartman from South Park, Scooby Doo, Arthur, and Space Ghost among the worst), and some of the best of missing (Quick Draw Mc Graw, Huckleberry Hound, Super Snooper and Blabber Mouse, Mr. Jinx, Snagglepuss, among others).

[email] (Joe Bevilacqua) wrote in message

Errr, probably not Cartman alone, but something that's regularly challenged society (and you could be one of the majority that can't recognize this) like South Park has throughout its run deserves far more recognition that anything that's ever come from Hanna-Barbera. It would've been a favor to the world had Hanna-Barbera never existed. Well, then again, we wouldn't have had Space Ghost Coast to Coast and The Brak Show. Just look at Harvey Birdman; all Hanna-Barbera's shows are good for are the jokes you can make about them.

Ryan

That show is beginning to scare/unnerve me. The one with Jabberjaw and the Neptunes getting sued being an excellent example. It's like they tapped into, taped, and animated my inner dialog.

Brett

Steve Mindykowski wrote in message news:...

My list:

• Dino
• Bandit (Johnny Quest's dog)
• Astro (George Jetson's dog)

Space

I wonder is that the original, or the SG Coast to Coast talk show version? (SGC2C is hilarious, MG was even on it once.)

"Steve Mindykowski" wrote in message news:[email]...

"Ol' Kentucky Shark" wrote in message news:bTj19.13352$[email]...

Probably the original Spaceghost. I used to love the old show. But of course, Coast-2-Coast IS hilarious, indeed!!

On Wed, 31 Jul 2002 03:42:24 GMT, "fishisms" wrote:

} } "Ol' Kentucky Shark" wrote in message } news:bTj19.13352$[email]... } > I wonder is that the original, or the SG Coast to Coast talk show } > version? (SGC2C is hilarious, MG was even on it once.) } } Probably the original Spaceghost. I used to love the old show. But } of course, Coast-2-Coast IS hilarious, indeed!! } The image with the article is from SGC2C.

Ange Faitore replies to:

Steve Mindykowski wrote in message news:...

One thing I objected was "Bart's middle name is Jo-Jo" thing. Matt Groening, Gracie Films or Bongo Comics (or whoever is in charge of OFF now) never officialized this, did they? I've never heard Bart being refered to as "Jo-Jo". Then again, maybe it was from an episode I didn't see or a scene cut in syndication. :)

Ange Faitore Clueless Simpsons Collector

Ange Faitore wrote:

Reportedly, Groening agreed to the name upon its suggestion by Nancy Cartwright.

It's never been used on the show.

"Clair "9cds" Shaw" wrote in message news:sgZ2$[email]...

What does the "J" mean in Homer J. Simpson? I always assumed either "Jackass" or "Jerkface".

"dp" wrote in message news:aic8ia$[email]...

Matt Groening says that the J. in Bart is for "Jojo."

In a recent episode of Simpsons we find that Homer's J. stands for..."Jay."

The entire Simpson family have the same middle initial. It is in tribute to the famous Jay Ward.

Ramsey

"Ramso" wrote in message news:LCi29.64613$[email]...

for..."Jay."

to

Bullwinkle J. Moose! Now I get it...

"dp" wrote in message news:aiccrd$[email]...

I'd like to see a future character on "The Simpsons" named Ponsonby Britt.

<question marks flash over other posters heads>

"Ponsonby Britt" was credited as the "executive producer" of "Rocky & Bullwinkle", but in reality this person never existed. In fact, neither did the title of EP, so producers Jay Ward and Bill Scott created the name.

At least Felix the Cat is #28. I know he's not really popular at all anymore, but I always thought he was pretty cool. He was actually the first thing in history to ever appear on TV. When they tested out television broadcasts, the first image was a still photo of Felix

I think I would have put "Star Blazers" on the list if only because it's a cult touchstone for people of a certain age. It seems there are a LOT of people in their 30's who remember the show and its catchy theme song.

Or am I wrong about that?

I'm pretty sure i heard that it was Lisa Marie Simpson...not sure where, though

david