About the trading

I think this discussion about trading-annoyance (which I started) is getting a little out of hand. I never ever intented to introduce any kind of censorship in a newsgroup. This isn't a communist country that has to fight the Evil Capitalists. There's nothing wrong with making a bit of money. But when it looks like these messages about trading/buying/selling seem to double in size every few months, I think people should be reminded of the intented purpose of this group, which, in my opinion, is sharing the love for seinfeld and having fun discussing the show (or any related topics). If posters that need episodes to complete their collection and the people selling those episodes continue to talk "past" eachother, I feel some action is needed, like for instance a separate trading-group, or (if possible) a major cut in the number of threads concerning trading.

I hope I've clarified my standing on this topic, and maybe my topic of the post that started this discussion was a bit too harsh, to them who felt offended I apologize (there's nothing wrong with looking for ep-traders but please tap into an ongoing discussion instead of creating yet another thread)

wouter

Threads are threads, you have every right to skip over them. This group is /was designed to discuss seinfeld, that includes every and all discussions on seinfeld. Utilize your killfile and stop whining.

"Wouter Visser" wrote in message news:9i596s$pld$[email]...

getting

fight

But

but

Wouter Visser wrote:

But the buyers and sellers might be from communist countries, or even worse, socialist ones... ohhhh

But stealing by not respecting copyright in a Capitalist country IS.

:-)

Ya know, the Frasier newsgroup found an interesting way to deal with bootleggers. One of the executive producers of the show (not to mention one of the copywright holders) is a frequent contributor to the group. When someone shows up selling tapes or CDs, he passes the information on to his attorneys.

Shame we don't have Jerry or Larry David among us.

Dave (or do we?)

"Dave" wrote in message news:[email]...

Dave, are you a seinfeld fan? If so, do you own any copies of seinfeld? I would wager you do. So why don't you give the people who don't a break. All they want to do is possess their own seinfeld collection.

As for the people who want to profit financially from seinfeld episodes by bootlegging, I think it's wrong, but who am I or you to judge others when we have our own collection sitting in our room unlawfully.

I like to think so. I wrote the FAQ.

Absolutely. 180 episodes on about 14 VHS tapes.

Then let them get their collections the same way I got mine. I taped them myself.

My collection isn't unlawful. You're allowed to tape a copy for personal use.

Dave (how'd you get yours?)

"Dave" wrote in message news:[email]...

I "thought" it was prohibited? Especially if you have all 180, am I wrong?

Dave's not here, this is Ronald, and I honestly got mine buying from a bootlegger *lol* How long did it take you to actually tape every episode? They don't even play every episode anymore, so I'm wondering if you really taped them all yourself like your saying?

And just because you taped them all yourself, does that mean your more lawful of a person who bought from a bootlegger? There's absolutely no way people can tape every episode these days, so please cut us a break.

Yep, you're wrong. As Dave pointed out, you're allowed to make a personal copy for yourself (and the number of episodes taped is irrelevant), but it's illegal to sell those copies. At least, that's how I've always understood it; anyone here with a background in copyright law that could confirm this?

Actually, it does. :-) Convenience has never been a concern of the law.

For what it's worth, I really don't care if people trade/sell bootleg episodes. (I'd prefer it if advertisements for such weren't posted here, but that's a whole 'nuther discussion...) However, if you want to talk about what's legal, then there really isn't a whole lot of room for personal interpretation.

"John Twernbold" wrote in message news:ZRT17.143729$[email]...

it's

this?

I stand corrected.

There's no way anyone could tape every episode of seinfeld these days. I appreciate the bootleggers.

but

This place is the perfect venue to find and/or trade seinfeld episodes. If not here, where?

Exactly, plus I don't like to get into the legalities on issues like these, because people will say I'll never sell/trade copyrighted materials, but yet they would download mp3's from napster, etc.

On Sun, 08 Jul 2001 05:38:40 GMT, "Ronald" wrote:

With cable, I can see 14 different Seinfeld episodes a week. I have never conducted a survey, but I am pretty sure I see each of the 180 episodes (minus The Puerto Rican Day) on a two year rotation without watching every single day.

It is not that hard to tape every episode, and someone with a VCR and cable could easily accomplish that in less than 18 months.

And taping a show for my own later viewing is not illegal.

Sophie

"Sophie" wrote in message news:[email]...

I have satellite and I cannot watch 14 different seinfeld episodes a week. I'm wondering what channels are you watching these episodes on?

speaking for regular television broadcast in my area, they skip a lot, if not half of all episopdes, and only replay certains ones over and over again.

Not in my area of the United States, and certainly not on any of my satellite channels they cannot.

I think we established that already in the previous threads =)

No, that's incorrect, assuming you have the same syndication feed as the rest of the country. While it's true they run certain episodes more often (apparently according to the original ratings received), they do eventually run *all* the episodes with the exception of "The Puerto Rican Day".

"John Twernbold" wrote in message news:1b527.147233$[email]...

eventually

That's Incorrect, they do not play every episode in syndication these days in my area, and epsecially on satellite t.v.

Very greatful to the bootleggers!

You can believe whatever you'd like, but I assure you that if you're in the US and you're seeing the standard syndication package from Columbia TriStar Distribution, they do play every episode eventually (again, with the exception of "The Puerto Rican Day"). I realize it may not *seem* like they do if you just watch for a month or so, but they do eventually air them all.

If you'd like to find out which station in your area runs this package, check the "station search" here: http://www.spe.sony.com/tv/shows/seinfeld/stations.phtml

Okay I'll take a look and see what stations run them, thanks for the link.

"John Twernbold" wrote in message news:iG827.148129$[email]...

the

TriStar

they

all.

Also, I always made sure to watch seinfeld on regular t.v. every day for months on end. I thought for sure I seen every episode until I purchased my copies from bootleg and was shocked at the amount of episodes I never seen, or perhaps seen one time when they first came out years ago.

As for the lady who stated she could watch 14 different episodes a week? on cable, I would like to know which channels those are, because as I said earlier, I have satellite and have only found the seinfelds on local channels.

"John Twernbold" wrote in message news:iG827.148129$[email]...

the

TriStar

they

all.

On Sun, 08 Jul 2001 20:51:55 GMT, "Ronald" wrote:

I live in Canada, so I get both Canadian and American channels (I think that's why we systematically rank so high with the U.N.)

I watch Seinfeld reruns on the Fox affiliate from some city near Toronto (can't remember which), on R.O. (a local Ottawa station) and on City TV (from Toronto). Fox and City often show the same episode the same day, but it's different from the R.O. ep, hence 14 different episodes a week on average. I could also watch Seinfeld on some local Montr�al station, I don't know if they would show the same as one of the two I already watch (probably).

Ottawa really is the centre of the Universe, I guess.

Sophie

The problem is that not everybody in the world lives in the USA (although some might not realize it) In some areas we are glad for the bootleg copies purely because we do not have access to what we want to watch. In the instance of Seinfeld, in New Zealand we have only every had the last 3 seasons shown once on network tv. (They have been rerun on sky, though.) I was grateful for copies of Frasier going up online last year, because we have not had the first episode of the season yet, which started screening in the States in October last year; we are two seasons behind in NYPD blue, and more than 2 years behind in Law and Order. I know some of these shows have not been made availiable like Seinfeld has through bootlegging, but although it may be legally wrong to engage in such activity, we are at the whim of the programmers and need bootleggers to see the shows we want at times. So the morality of the bootlegging is a lot more complex than the purely legal stance.

Yeah. As far as I know, you're allowed to tape a single copy of an aired show for personal use.

It took about 8 months. I printed a list and checked them off as they appeared in syndication, plus the new Thursday night episode each week. I started during season 6 IIRC.

If you are dilligent enough, you can tape every episode. As for the "cut us a break" part, this wasn't even my argument. Take it up with the "Don't buy and sell here" contingent.

Dave (nothing wrong with bootlegging, except it's illegal.)

"Ronald" wrote in message news:AlS17.167$[email]...

You're right: while the taping for personal use of 179 episodes or less is merely frowned upon, taping 180 counts as a felony. A loophole has been established however since the Supreme Court ruled in 2001 (Sacamano vs Rifkind) that the double episodes can count as only one episode each. (An earlier plea in Vandelay vs Van Nostrond 1999 however - that the compilation episodes don't count at all - was found to be invalid since "Mr Seinfeld made various introductions in each piece - which by any legal standard must therefore constitute new material and thus render each compilation a separate and distinct entity or 'episode' in its own right").

Of course anyone who was paying attention however during George W Bush's inauguration speech will be well aware that he has made the closing of this loophole the single main priority of his term of office.

Note: various "Seinfeld Rights" campaigners are already suggesting the "tape-over-the-Puerta-Rican-flag-episode" option to anyone with all episodes currently living in fear of imminent arrest.

I think you need to take into consideration what the Supreme Court recently ruled upon in case of P.G. Penny Packer Vs. Putty, and prior to that, Baboo Vs. Newman. I really thought "Jackie", Attorney at Law did a hell of a job on the cases in question.

"Tod Friendly" wrote in message news:9iio5m$hmi$[email]...

wrong?

compilation

must

this

episodes

What country are you talking about? If you didn't know, I can inform you that the whole world has access to this newsgroup.

/Stefan (in sweden)

There are some countries that do not allow their citizens to view the whole internet, for example. But with a communist country I actually meant this newsgroup. It's shouldn't ban the innocent advertizers it's had so far.