When did the characters become "evil" ?????

Watching the recently shown syndicated early eps, I am reminded that the characters are quite shallow, but well-intentioned. Why then, has everyone suddenly decided that they are reprehensible human beings? They definitely became increasingly shallow over the years, but I still don't think they became horrid. A few months before the finale, after the announcement that the show would end, we suddenly started hearing the media assertions about "four callous and self-absorbed New Yorkers."

Who started this?? Who decided that the characters had crossed the line from shallow to mean?? Was it NBC (i.e. the writers/producers/etc.)? Perhaps this type of media-relayed prep work was done to justify the finale. I am glad to watch these early shows because it reminds me of what I adore about the characters . . . they are just like us, but funnier. They say things that we FEEL but don't consciously realize that we are feeling until we hear them say it. They are NOT evil, cold, callous, etc. They are just like me (but they get better looking dates)

beings?

That word "reprehensible" was actually an at least half-joking quote from Jerry Seinfeld himself, echoed by Larry David, Kenny Kramer and others connected with the show and its real-life inspirations. In fact, they weren't "reprehensible"...but the satire worked so well because they are, in many ways, "representative" of a lot of the faults and foibles of a whole generation of under-50 Americans...and we can see, and laugh at, an exaggerated representation of some of our own quirks and failings.

Bob Smith, afternoons WXXI-AM 1370, Rochester NY

Brantley30 asked:

Good question.

I think it was Larry David and Jerry Seinfeld and other cast members and behind-the-scenes types. For years, I've been hearing and reading their comments that what sets their show apart is the fact that the characters are "unlikable," "unlovable," "selfish," "self-absorbed," "they don't care who they hurt," etc. And yet I've never really felt that way about them. I *did* like them all, and I certainly will miss seeing what they're up to every Thursday...not just the core four but the recurring characters like Puddy, Newman, Peterman, et al.

Let's take them one by one. Elaine was a *very* likable, spunky, dynamic, free-thinking character for most of the show's run. Yes, she became a little more openly obnoxious from the time she took over for Peterman, but I think she remained an essentially likable character. And who didn't feel affection for Kramer, with his wild ideas, upbeat attitude, live-and-let-live philosophy, and deft physical comedy? Jerry (the character) seemed like a person who would have been good on the friendship/conversation level, although women viewers might not have wanted to date and be dumped by him. And then there's George.. Well, three out of four ain't bad.

Could it be that the selfishness and self-absorption of George and, to a lesser extent, Jerry, just kind of slopped over onto Elaine and Kramer, and they picked up the label of "four" unlikable characters, and the label just stuck?

Todd K

three out of four ain't bad.

I thought of George's bad rep the other day when he was so upset about the busboy losing his job and worried that his offhand comment might have played a part in his getting fired. Even George had his moments. He insisted on going to see if he was ok.

<<I am glad to watch these early shows because it reminds me of what I adore about the characters . . . they are just like us, but funnier. They say things that we FEEL but don't consciously realize that we are feeling until we hear them say it. They are NOT evil, cold, callous, etc. >>

exactly!

suddenly decided that they are reprehensible human beings? >>

My guess: very few people are willing to look at their own set of flaws.

The real question in my mind is when did people start perceiving them as evil?

And if they have thought of them as evil, why have they been watching the show or participating in a newsgroup about it?

Not evil as in a satanic or demonic way, but evil as in very, very selfish. They're always out for their own gain. They may not intentionally try to hurt other people, but they do.

D.P. Roberts responded:

Who doesn't unintentionally hurt others on occasion?   It's part of life.  I
don't think this is the point of the show, though.  What makes the show so
funny and insightful as that the writers, via the characters,  articulate our
insecurities, discomforts, and pet peeves in an open way that we could never
do.   It bothers me that it's only been lately that the characters have been
deemed selfish and ruthless, and I have to think that it's in part to make it
easier to justify/accept the finale.

I don't think they're evil. I think they're just closer to normal than we're used to seeing portrayed in sitcoms.

they're not actually evil...but even if they were...that means what we cant enjoy to watch and talk about them? why not?