What happened to this group?

What happened to this group? Where is everybody Where are the posts?

On Fri, 14 Nov 2003 06:34:27 GMT Patrick D. Rockwell wrote:

} What happened to this group? Where is everybody Where are the posts?

It went south. The posts are on google groups. The show started downhill when they abandoned the deniability of the Nancy Gribble and John Redcorn affair. Now was that just before or just after Peggy Hill's parachute didn't open and she hit the ground at terminal velocity? They might have been able to explore some serious issues if she had died.

How about yourself? Do you have ten favorite quotes or episodes or characters? How about Brooklyn? Why are his roles so insignificant?

"R J Valentine" wrote in message news:[email]...

wrote:

Deniability? Do you mean that they used to have it so that you weren't sure if they were having one or not?

True, but I'm not sure if the show were meant to be that serious. I'm ambivilant about whether or not I like Peggy's role or not. On the one hand, she is deliciously egocentric and sick minded, it's fascinating to watch her. But on the other hand, it can be painful to watch her get away with her garbage, like the time that Bobby DIDN'T want her to carry his birthday cake for his thirteenth birthday, and not only did she do it anyway, but she humiliated Bobby in front of his friends by morphing herself into grand master Peggy. It's kinda hard to know what I mean if you didn't see that episode. I wish that they'd do more episodes where she'd get into alot of trouble for that kind of crap, or just make her mentally normal.

Hmm, I guess one of my favorite episodes is the one that I think is called "Lost In Partyland". It's the one where Peggy Hill broke Bill's arm because Hank had to take his mother and some old ladies out and about, and Bill thought that this was his chance to woo Peggy away from Hang with his flabby gut, his chilly stained undershirt, and his questionable hygene. As for quotes, there are alot of gems there, but I don't recall any specific one right now.

Who is Brooklyn? :-)

On Mon, 17 Nov 2003 01:41:12 GMT Patrick D. Rockwell wrote:

} "R J Valentine" wrote in message } news:[email]... }> On Fri, 14 Nov 2003 06:34:27 GMT Patrick D. Rockwell } wrote: }> }> } What happened to this group? Where is everybody Where are the posts? }> }> It went south. The posts are on google groups. The show started downhill }> when they abandoned the deniability of the Nancy Gribble and John Redcorn }> affair. Now was that just before or just after Peggy Hill's parachute } } Deniability? Do you mean that they used to have it so that you weren't sure } if they were having one or not?

Oh, some people were always sure they were. That'd be the joke. They started in the very first episode when Joseph made his first appearance, apparently of a different racial heritage than either parent. I know all sorts of people for whom that happens in real life, either from adoption or from previous {marriage, relationship, or rape}. The continuity stank early on, so for a while they had Joseph being older than the time Nancy Gribble had known John Redcorn. They had episodes about the fertility clinic that Hank and Peggy went to, and there had been previous episodes of Mike Judge's _Beavis and Butthead_ where they had caused all sorts of mixups at a fertility clinic. They showed they young Bill looking a lot more like Bobby Hill than Hank ever did. They had an episode about jumping to conclusions. Most everyone knows a wife or mother who has been naked in the presence of a medical practitioner. It's just not that big a stretch. Certainly not more of a stretch than Peggy surviving a parachuteless fall to earth from an airplane. And it would have the advantage of not making a big joke about adultery on a prime-time show that kids watch. It wasn't until they showed Nancy Gribble in bed with John Redcorn in the episode where Dale Gribble went crazier than normal that it became *just* a dirty little running joke. Almost everything they showed about Nancy Gribble, they also showed about Peggy Hill. They showed Nancy Gribble dancing with John Redcorn, and they showed Peggy Hill dancing with Bill Dauterive. They showed Nancy Gribble going to John Redcorn for headache treatments, and they showed Peggy Hill going to John Redcorn for headache treatments. Joseph looks a little like John Redcorn, and Bobby Hill looks a little like Bill Dauterive (who knew Bobby's middle name when even Bobby didn't). They managed to have Boomhauer the sex fiend not touch Luanne the sexpot when she slept over at his house. Up until they showed Nancy Gribble and John Redcorn in bed together (in, what is it, the third or fourth season?), if any religious group had complained about their making light of adultery, they could have come up with an episode explaining it all and pointing out that it was only the characters with the dirtiest of minds who would assume something like that. Bobby never did. Joseph never did. Connie never did. Dale (who risked his life to save Bobby from the fire ants) never did. Even Peggy never did until she came under the influence of other characters. Bill at least claimed not to have.

But they blew it.

At least now the first two seasons are out on DVD and anyone can watch them from the start with either mindset. Don't listen to the commentary, though, because they snicker about the affair like isn't Dale stupid for trusting his wife in the presence of other men when any Texan knows that wives should be watched like a hawk. They're immune from religious groups now.

R J Valentine wrote in message news:...

This is a fun argument to revive... the thing about the affair is that it *wasn't* "just a dirty little running joke." It was the defining thing about Dale's character. Dale is, in many ways, a horrible person: treacherous, cowardly, stupid. What made his behavior understandable was that there was something going on in his life -- the infidelity of his wife -- that he just doesn't want to know about. His conspiracy theorizing is understandable because, like many conspiracy theorists, he constructs a loopy theory of how the world "really" is in order to shield himself from the truths that he doesn't want to acknowledge. In other words, it's being in denial about Nancy that has made him the way he is. I wouldn't find that nearly as interesting if he were in denial about something that didn't happen. And his genuine love for a child who isn't his also makes him a more multilayered character. Then, too, John Redcorn is an interesting character because he talks like the stereotypical Wise Medicine Man but is actually just a gigolo -- if he were *really* a Wise Medicine Man, that wouldn't be as interesting. I mean, as you say, you can watch the first two seasons however you want, but I don't think it's nearly as interesting or complex if you interpret it so they're *not* having an affair (and it was always the intention ot the staff that they would be having an affair; the only reason it wasn't stated directly was not so much for religious groups as for the children in the audience -- not that creators' intentions are necessarily important; I read things into the show that I know the writers didn't necessarily intend).

On 17 Nov 2003 05:49:30 -0800 Arlen Texas wrote:

} R J Valentine wrote in message news:... } }> It wasn't until they showed Nancy Gribble in bed with }> John Redcorn in the episode where Dale Gribble went crazier than normal }> that it became *just* a dirty little running joke. } } This is a fun argument to revive... the thing about the affair is that } it *wasn't* "just a dirty little running joke." It was the defining } thing about Dale's character. Dale is, in many ways, a horrible } person: treacherous, cowardly, stupid.

[Many excellent points snipped.]

The down side of that is that it makes that horrible, treacherous, cowardly, stupid person by far the noblest character on the show other than the kids (not that there's anything wrong with that). Cotton Hill comes in a close second. The rest are no friends to anyone, lousy role models, and a disgrace to Texas.

As long as there was ambiguity, they had a way out. Now they're vulnerable to the first religious group that wakes up and smells the coffee (not that any of them are likely to).

It makes a body look back on Beavis and Butt-Head in admiration. Who would believe just a few years ago that they could grow up to be President?

"R J Valentine" wrote in message news:[email]...

news:...

They are? What do you not like about Hank? Boomhaur? Of the four friends, he's one of the two who ISN'T a loser. He has faults, and has done SOME things that I don't like, such has the time that he played keepaway with the others using Hanks butt prosthetic, or the time that he used the "Jaws Of Life" to open a fire hydrant, but basically, not bad.

Hank is the best of the bunch I think. He has his faults. He thinks WAY TOO MUCH about propane and propane accessories, can be pickyunish(sp) (how do you spell that anyway?), is too concerned with Bobby's manhood, and has some unintentionally racist qualities such as his inability to remember Kahn's nationality, but he's honest, responsible, hardworking, a loving and devoted family man, and anyone who could come away from a father like his without being a serial killer CAN'T be all that bad.

Did you say that Dale was the noblest person on the show? With Cotton as a close second? Correct me if I got that wrong. :-)

I would have nominated Dale as the worst character on the show. The closest thing to being evil without actually being evil. His only good qualities that I can think of are that he's a loving husband and father, and he pays the cable bills. Even then, I wouldn't even wish a white trash wife on him like Nancy. Cotton Hill is by far the worst. A woman hating masogenist with a mean mouth who probably has a date rape under his belt.

all of this is IMHO of course. ;-)

On Tue, 18 Nov 2003 23:42:55 GMT Patrick D. Rockwell wrote: ... } Did you say that Dale was the noblest person on the show? With Cotton as a } close second? Correct me if I got that wrong. :-) ...

Except for the kids. All the regular kids are fine, including Stewart Dooley. Dale gave up his life to save Bobby's. Nobody else came close, except Cotton Hill, who gave up his shins for his country.

Dale and Cotton both have respect for Bobby Hill, which is more than can be said for the rest of the adults.

Bobby of course is praeternaturally noble, but then that's why he has the title role.

"R J Valentine" wrote in message news:[email]...

wrote:

a

Hmm, well, I know that Peggy and Bill don't have that much respect for Bobby. Peggy because of that out-of-control ego of hers, and I'd say Bill because of that one time when he made Bobby buy some hormone laced dog bisquits for him in exchange for a bunch of information that he had no business imparting to him (such as, "Is Bobby adopted?"). To say nothing of the time that Bill ACTUALLY thought that he could take Hanks place in the family, that one time when Hank had to take his mother and a bunch of her old friends on a trip. Peggy broke Bill's arm for that one.

But how does Hank not respect Bobby? I mean, Hank is a little bit too anal retentive, and too concerned with Bobby's masculinity, like when he won't let Bobby play "Tomb Raider", NOT because of the violence, but because he thinks that just because the main character is female, that it means that Bobby is playing a female. Or like last week in "Reborn To Be Wild" when he wouldn't let Bobby join what was basically a Christian group of really nice kids. Hanks parenting isn't exactly what I'd choose, but how does he not respect Bobby?

On Wed, 19 Nov 2003 04:53:14 GMT Patrick D. Rockwell wrote: ... } But how does Hank not respect Bobby? ...

Is there any one single quote that encapsulates Hank's attitude toward Bobby? I propose: "That boy ain't right." What's the name of the only book about the series?

I think Hank mostly gives Bobby the respect he deserves -- if anything, Hank's too easy on Bobby. Bobby frequently does some obnoxious things with few if any consequences (if *I* kicked my dad in the nuts, you can bet I'd get a worse punishment than having my Game-Boy taken away), and Hank mostly allows Bobby to be the way he is without trying to force him to be something he isn't. Hank only steps in when Bobby is clearly going to get in trouble -- as in the modelling episode -- or when he needs to assert his authority to raise Bobby the way he wants (e.g. pulling him out of MessiahFest because he doesn't want religion just being another cool fad that Bobby will soon tire of). Bobby gets plenty of respect for a kid who has stolen propane and allowed his friend to cop a look at his naked cousin.

Hank is considerably harder on Luanne than he is on Bobby, given that he frequently belittles her, ignores her, shies away from any display of affection toward her, and mostly treats her like she's not quite good enough to be considered a part of his family ("I bought tickets for all the Hill family. Hank *Hill*, Peggy Hill, and Bobby *Hill*"). Some of the troubles in Luanne episodes are caused by Hank's treatment of her (for example, in the Halloween episode, Luanne allows herself to be brainwashed by Junie Harper because Junie, unlike Hank, doesn't call her stupid). But then, Hank doesn't have much respect for his friends Bill or Dale, either. Not that they deserve it.

"Arlen Texas" wrote in message news:[email]...

Good [address] seem to remember Hank telling Kahn that he doesn't believe in spanking. That's where I think Hank has it wrong.I think that it was completely wrong for Hank and Peggy to make let that time Bobby lied to them about the social worker (pilot episode) turn into a warm fuzzy where Hank had to tell Bobby he loved him, instead of giving him the rump roasting that he deserved.

Another good point. Although Luanne can be pretty obnoxious at times. Like the time that she fell in love (if that's what she calls it) with a communist, so naturally she thought that she had to convert Hank and the others to communism, and was even getting the manger babies involved.

"Patrick D. Rockwell" wrote in message news:...

Excellent example. I think that's a case of unclear writing (somewhat understandable since it was the first episode); we're told near the end that Bobby only did it so Hank would love him no matter what or some such thing, but what we actually saw earlier in the episode was that Bobby was exploiting the situation so Hank couldn't punish him no matter what mischief he did. So when Peggy says that "Bobby didn't do it to be mean," everything we've seen on screen up to that point contradicts her. And Bobby has an irresponsible streak that has been part of his character ever since that episode.

Yes, and it was the funniest scene ever ("Get that penguin back here, I'm not done!"). But remember that when Hank actually bothered to talk to Luanne and explain that she should vote based on the issues rather than looks, he got her to listen to politicians' speeches and make a somewhat informed decision (she decided to vote for Bush because "He's going to cut my taxes and let me pray in Junior College"). By the end of the episode it was Hank who was letting silly things influence his voting -- Bush's handshake, mostly -- and Luanne who was giving him the talk on why he should vote anyway. So in that episode, as in others, problems come about because Hank is too aloof from Luanne to just talk to her and explain things to her. It's a common theme with Hank/Luanne. When she was kidnapped by the evil cult, Hank thought she was on drugs. It's one of the darker sides to Hank's character, the way he treats her; you could even argue that there's an element of classism in it (the subtext of "Texas City Twister" is that Hank considers his niece "trailer trash" and therefore that she should be back in the trailer park where she belongs), but that might be getting too analytical.

"Arlen Texas" wrote in message news:[email]...

news:...

rump

Thanks. Another example was when Bobby took a woman's self defense course, and took to kicking people in the groin. He must've thought of himself as the Chuck Norris of ball crushers. He should've gotten his ass kicked for doing it to his parents if nothing else. :-)

getting

ber that when Hank actually bothered

Yeah, that's the most annoying (therefore the funniest) feature of Hank's personality IMHO. He tends to make big issues about small things. If I'm not mistaken, he voted for Lyndon Johnson for president simply because Johnson was from Texas, and would probably have voted for Satan if he were from Texas too! Providing that Satan has a good strong handshake, of course. :-) In a previous post, I used the word "Pickeyunish(sp)". Is my spelling correct? Is there another word for that?

For example, do you remember the time that Hank was on a plane to Japan with his father so that Cotton could meet his long lost half Japanese son? Hank sat next to someone who was having a beer, and said something like "Sir, do you think that you should be doing that? We're on duty". And when the man ignored him, Hank hit a button and said "Ok, you're outta here!". What did Hank mean? What were they on Duty for?

Then there was the time that he practically shit his pants when he was in Mr. Strickland's home and realized that Mr. Strickland used an electric stove instead of a gas stove. Maybe I just don't understand the Propane salesman mind. :-)

Or when Hank was making Bobby smoke to break him of smoking, and he was criticizing the way Bobby was holding his cigarette.

Also, the time that he got all flustered because he found out that he was born in New York.

And let's not forget the time that Hank went to a focus group to kill the new version of the mower that he uses just because he didn't want to upgrade, and proved his point by showing that the new model will crash if someone does a combination of things that not even an idiot would do. (I mean, even Hank's current mower has operational limitations, doesn't it?). He bulldogged everyone into voting his way, (except that useless Bill who just automatically let's Hank do his thinking for him).

I think that he's also too fussy about Bobby's manhoodand other traits. I don't know why. If Luanne has has a feminine item in the house, such as a wig or dress, he tells her to hide it from Bobby. There was also that time when Bobby wanted to wear his sleaves rolled up to copy a friend from New York, and Hank made him roll them back down.

Needless to say, there is Hank's slavish obsession with and deification of propane. He touts the 14 reasons for using Strickland Propane when MegloMart sells it cheaper (or has MegloMart never been rebuilt after the explosion). Hank was SO MAD at MegloMart at one time that he made his family throw out ALL products in the house that were bought from it, as well as anything that touched those products. He also refers to his service calls as "propane emergencies", and of course Peggy refers to herself as a "propane wife".

Oh, the MegloMart explosion reminds me of the time that Hank was in a crowd of people who were looking at a building that either blew up or burned down, and he said "Please Don't Let It Be The Propane Tanks" (as if that would make a difference :-) ). Was that the MegloMart explosion?

Comments anyone?

On Wed, 26 Nov 2003 22:09:04 GMT Patrick D. Rockwell wrote: ... } For example, do you remember the time that Hank was on a plane to Japan with } his father so that Cotton could } meet his long lost half Japanese son? Hank sat next to someone who was } having a beer, and said something like } "Sir, do you think that you should be doing that? We're on duty". And when } the man ignored him, Hank hit a button } and said "Ok, you're outta here!". What did Hank mean? What were they on } Duty for? ...

Were they sitting next to the emergency exit?

"R J Valentine" wrote in message news:[email]...

wrote:

with

when

\

Hmm, I don't fly much. There isn't a requirement for passenger sitting next to the emergency exits to not drink beer, is there?

On Thu, 27 Nov 2003 03:18:08 GMT Patrick D. Rockwell wrote: ... } Hmm, I don't fly much. There isn't a requirement for passenger sitting next } to the emergency exits to not drink beer, is there?

No right-thinking American accepting the responsibility (and increased leg-room) of an emergency-exit seat would do so in any way impaired. They've got some serious restrictions on who [it is that] they allow in those seats. When the lights go out and the water starts coming in, you want to hope there isn't some confused drunk in the way, I tell you what.

"Patrick D. Rockwell" -------->

Japan

on

next

I think it was something about those sitting by the emergency exit were asked to assist in evacuating of the plane if there were an emergency. Hence "On Duty"

bill n

"Patrick D. Rockwell" wrote in news:TH_sb.20031$[email]:

This group has been dead or just-barely-hanging-on for years. For some reason KOTH just can't seem to keep up a Usenet presence. Probably the same reason as why there aren't any nude pictures of Luanne anywhere.

"Governor Breck" wrote in message news:[email]...

Dead? I didn't even know it was sick. A month ago, the group seemed more lively. Anyway, I'm hoping that someone can answer the question in my "Reborn To Be Wild" post which was, "What was the tune that Bobby was rocking out on at the beginning of the episode". Gene Simmons was a guest voice in this one. :-)