Peggy re-incarnated???

From: Pstokely Subject: Re: My guess on cliffhanger resolution. Date: Wednesday, May 19, 1999 1:21 PM

how, it was concieved before she may have died

Tucson coyote here,

This is an novel idea.. I mean sure the baby is conceived but has anyone heard of "soul transference?' (This is something that Fox Moulder and Dana Scully would investigate!) but the theory is that the baby is being born at the moment when Peggy died... Now if this is the case.. The soul of Peggy Hill was transferred (by an act of God!) was transferred to the infant??? I think it could be very plausible... (of course it is a bit of a stretch...!)

Tucson Coyote

Tucson Coyote wrote:

Yes, but would Peggy want to be raised by Cotten and Didi?

Matt Lupo

In article , "G. M. Lupo" wrote:

Yikes!

What would Cotten call her?

Didi's Hank's wife

Actually, they did this already with Buck, the dog, in "Married With Children" and unlike Buck who ends up liviing with the Bundys again for all his misdeeds, I don't think Peggy deserves the punishment of having Cotton and Didi as parents. :P Though it would certainly be bizarre Peggy and Hank sharing the same father.

It

The fact is that we don't know if Peggy died or not. Also, we don't know if the baby is a boy or a girl. We'll find out in the fall.

DEL-LAGO wrote:

] The fact is that we don't know if Peggy died or not. Also, we don't ] know if the baby is a boy or a girl. We'll find out in the fall.

We saw her hit the ground; we heard the death chords. This isn't like "obvious" running jokes where they've studiously avoided showing us stuff that they show for almost all the other characters. The only cliff-hanger there is whether she knew what was going to happen when she stepped out of the plane.

And the baby can't be anything but a girl.

If Peggy is alive and it's a boy, they will have thrown away hundreds of good plot lines. They're not great on continuity, and they have a history of pulling the audience's legs, but they're not stupid.

The fact is that we don't know if Peggy died or not. Also, we don't ] know if the baby is a boy or a girl. We'll find out in the fall.

We saw her hit the ground; we heard the death chords. This isn't like "obvious" running jokes where they've studiously avoided showing us stuff that they show for almost all the other characters. The only cliff-hanger there is whether she knew what was going to happen when she stepped out of the plane.

And the baby can't be anything but a girl.

If Peggy is alive and it's a boy, they will have thrown away hundreds of good plot lines. They're not great on continuity, and they have a history of pulling the audience's legs, but they're not stupid.

arch stanton wrote:

] I'll believe Peggy is fertilizer when I see it. I just can't see the ] writers doing something like this. Sure, there is much poignancy and ] drama in the show. But after all it is first and foremost a comedy. Hank ] will be moping around the house for a year before he and we the fans ] slowly forget about her. Unless they immediately replace her with some ] new firecracker but that is contrary to his personality. He would remain ] single and sulk. So, unless she left the show and they don't want to ] replace her voice (like they did with Thatherton) I expect Peggy to ] return. A little banged up but alive.

Well, I agree that they're unlikely to have Hank go wild all of a sudden. But what more could they do with Peggy's character with her alive. They've had the running joke of having her make a silly error in almost every episode for years. They've had her as a superwoman both intellectually as a Boggle champion and physically as a pitcher not only to mortal men but to a big-league baseball player. She has snatched the pebble from Mike Judge's hand, and it is time for her to go. She won't be gone completely, because they'll still have flashbacks and Bobby will no doubt be able to communicate with her. But portraying the ache of losing a wife, a mother, an aunt, and a daughter is a challenge that the creators appear to be up to, and it doesn't have to be funny. If suicide is suspected, that would open up even more territory. If she turns up alive, it would require a stretch that would make other outlandish plot possibilities (which we needn't mention now) pale into plausibility.

]                                       Oh, and as for the sex of the
] baby, one will be a girl and one will be a boy. You read right. Didi
] looked awfully BIG there didn't she? You know, Didi 's not the sharpest
] knife in the drawer. Maybe the doctor mentioned something about *twins*
] to her and she thought he was discussing her store-bought boobs. (both
] lefties)  :^)   Anyway, twins would be a lot of fun. Are you listening
] writers?

Now THAT'S a Gribble of an idea. I could go along with that one easily.

RJ, you sound as if you're actually _hoping_ that they kill Peggy off............I don't see how she's worn out her welcome any more than any of the other characters. Myself, if I was gonna elect an Arlenite ( Arlenian? Did we all ever decide about that? ) for the Big Sleep, it'd have to be Bill........he's just gotten too darn painful to watch. Help him or put 'im out of his misery, that's what I say! I just had a mental picture........supposing Peggy were to land on Nancy and John ( in mid-ahem-"act" ), thus saving her life while providing irrefutable proof of their affair ( once they'd been pulled apart and identified, that is.......kinda like readin' a wet newspaper.........).

Hey, if they're bound and determined to kill SOMEBODY off in that jump, I'd rather it be them than Peggy........at least _that'd_ be funny! Poor Nancy.......the migraines finally got her. As for John, why, they should erect a statue in commemoration of his sacrifice while in the line of duty, ministering to the sick.................yeah, unfortunate choice of words, I realize :)

If I sound cranky, it's because I'm suffering from profound Krispy Kreme deprivation........dangnab it, I'm TIRED of hearin' how good they are! I wanna try a few dozen myself, already.............why are there no west coast Krispy Kreme stands? It ain't fair, I tell ya, it just ain't fair!

Mark Jones wrote:

] RJ, you sound as if you're actually _hoping_ that they kill Peggy ] off............I don't see how she's worn out her welcome any more than ] any of the other characters.

I'll be sad to see her go, and I was surprised that the instructor didn't swoop in and either free one of the parachutes manually or cliping a line onto an emergency ring or whatever they do when something goes bad wrong. But how am I going to hold my head up hoping for a one-in-a-million soft landing when they showed her right there on the screen pulling both cords out by the roots, being abandoned by the instructor, saying the first two heys close up and the other two in a long shot with no sign of other parachutes or sky-divers that could give her an out; how am I going to hope that and still ask people to cite actual evidence of an adulterous affair between Nancy Gribble and John Redcorn? The one thing they showed plain as day, followed by the death chords used only once before (when Buckley died), and the other thing they haven't showed anything like the kissing and bed-sharing that they have shown for most of the other regular characters. I didn't wish her dead, but it would take a mighty fancy explanation to counter what they showed in those last few seconds.

If they had faded out in some other episode with Nancy Gribble and John Redcorn portrayed like Hank and Peggy under the covers, or Boomhauer and someone under the covers, or Boomhauer and someone coming out of a tent, of Bill and Leanne on the workbench, or Gary and Hank's mom on the kitchen table, or Kahn and Minh in the garage, or even Luanne and Buckley (fully clothed) on the fold-out couch, THEN I might say okay, it's too far a stretch to give them the benefit of the doubt. But Peggy they showed landing with a big "WHUMP!" Denial will take me only so far.

It's possible, but why would they show it and go for a far-fetched explanation, when they already have a good cliff-hanger in the baby (or babies)? We'll get more hints from the summer promos, though; but count on them to be misleading.

] Myself, if I was gonna elect an Arlenite ( ] Arlenian? Did we all ever decide about that? ) for the Big Sleep, it'd ] have to be Bill........he's just gotten too darn painful to watch. Help ] him or put 'im out of his misery, that's what I say!

I agree. But this could be the incident that does one or the other. I don't see how he can survive without Peggy. But they might have in mind that he helps Bobby and Hank through the early months and finds some sort of healing in that. Bill's got to fish or cut bait, true enough.

] I just had a mental picture........supposing Peggy were to land ] on Nancy and John ( in mid-ahem-"act" ), thus saving her life while ] providing irrefutable proof of their affair ( once they'd been pulled ] apart and identified, that is.......kinda like readin' a wet ] newspaper.........). ] ] Hey, if they're bound and determined to kill SOMEBODY off in that jump, ] I'd rather it be them than Peggy........at least _that'd_ be funny! Poor ] Nancy.......the migraines finally got her. As for John, why, they should ] erect a statue in commemoration of his sacrifice while in the line of ] duty, ministering to the sick.................yeah, unfortunate choice ] of words, I realize :)

Could be, but talk about a long shot. I'm guessing they'll play it straight. Would that flock of crows be hanging around in the vicinity of wild and sweaty sex? And what about poor Joseph and Dale? They'd have to strain audience credulity and still come up with the same recovery plot lines. Bobby and Hank seem better equipped to deal with the shock.

] If I sound cranky, it's because I'm suffering from profound Krispy Kreme ] deprivation........dangnab it, I'm TIRED of hearin' how good they are! I ] wanna try a few dozen myself, already.............why are there no west ] coast Krispy Kreme stands? It ain't fair, I tell ya, it just ain't fair!

Where are they available? I don't think I've seen them here in Maryland.

On Sat, 12 Jun 1999 18:21:51 GMT, R J Valentine wrote:

I've seen Krispy Kremes in both Tampa, Florida, and in Indianapolis I believe there is one.

Mark Jones wrote:

] RJ, you sound as if you're actually _hoping_ that they kill Peggy ] off............I don't see how she's worn out her welcome any more than ] any of the other characters.

I'll be sad to see her go, and I was surprised that the instructor didn't swoop in and either free one of the parachutes manually or clip a line onto an emergency ring or whatever they do when something goes bad wrong. But how am I going to hold my head up hoping for a one-in-a-million soft landing when they showed her right there on the screen pulling both cords out by the roots, being abandoned by the instructor, saying the first two heys close up and the other two in a long shot with no sign of other parachutes or sky-divers that could give her an out; how am I going to hope that and still ask people to cite actual evidence of an adulterous affair between Nancy Gribble and John Redcorn? The one thing they showed plain as day, followed by the death chords used only once before (when Buckley died), and the other thing they haven't showed anything like the kissing and bed-sharing that they have shown for most of the other regular characters. I didn't wish her dead, but it would take a mighty fancy explanation to counter what they showed in those last few seconds.

If they had faded out in some other episode with Nancy Gribble and John Redcorn portrayed like Hank and Peggy under the covers, or Boomhauer and someone under the covers, or Boomhauer and someone coming out of a tent, of Bill and Leanne on the workbench, or Gary and Hank's mom on the kitchen table, or Kahn and Minh in the garage, or even Luanne and Buckley (fully clothed) on the fold-out couch, THEN I might say okay, it's too far a stretch to give them the benefit of the doubt. But Peggy they showed landing with a big "WHUMP!" Denial will take me only so far.

It's possible, but why would they show it and go for a far-fetched explanation, when they already have a good cliff-hanger in the baby (or babies)? We'll get more hints from the summer promos, though; but count on them to be misleading.

] Myself, if I was gonna elect an Arlenite ( ] Arlenian? Did we all ever decide about that? ) for the Big Sleep, it'd ] have to be Bill........he's just gotten too darn painful to watch. Help ] him or put 'im out of his misery, that's what I say!

I agree. But this could be the incident that does one or the other. I don't see how he can survive without Peggy. But they might have in mind that he helps Bobby and Hank through the early months and finds some sort of healing in that. Bill's got to fish or cut bait, true enough.

] I just had a mental picture........supposing Peggy were to land ] on Nancy and John ( in mid-ahem-"act" ), thus saving her life while ] providing irrefutable proof of their affair ( once they'd been pulled ] apart and identified, that is.......kinda like readin' a wet ] newspaper.........). ] ] Hey, if they're bound and determined to kill SOMEBODY off in that jump, ] I'd rather it be them than Peggy........at least _that'd_ be funny! Poor ] Nancy.......the migraines finally got her. As for John, why, they should ] erect a statue in commemoration of his sacrifice while in the line of ] duty, ministering to the sick.................yeah, unfortunate choice ] of words, I realize :)

Could be, but talk about a long shot. I'm guessing they'll play it straight. Would that flock of crows be hanging around in the vicinity of wild and sweaty sex? And what about poor Joseph and Dale? They'd have to strain audience credulity and still come up with the same recovery plot lines. Bobby and Hank seem better equipped to deal with the shock.

] If I sound cranky, it's because I'm suffering from profound Krispy Kreme ] deprivation........dangnab it, I'm TIRED of hearin' how good they are! I ] wanna try a few dozen myself, already.............why are there no west ] coast Krispy Kreme stands? It ain't fair, I tell ya, it just ain't fair!

Where are they available? I don't think I've seen them here in Maryland.

The main suspicion is that the episode ends with a big cliffhanger, i.e. we see Peggy fall. We hear a whump! It does not look good. But . . . there is no funeral, no closure. It's like last year when four lives were at stake and they advertised right afterwards that someone is going to die. There is no such certainty this time around, except for the elements mentioned. And since that's how the episode ends . . . well, I smell "Cliffhanger" with Mike Judge grinning at all of us, even moreso than last year, I betcha! (Anyway, no one was seriously thinking of who died, since everyone deduced it was Buckley. The real question was that horrendous one of whether the Hills would move to Los Angeles!)

However, since Texas can be the land of tall tales, what is possible can happen and can be accepted. So Peggy could survive or be one of those lucky ones who survived, which can have quite a dramatic impact on her character and one I can more directly buy considering the overall tone of the series. I can see her taking it all very seriously and have her maybe continue either on the daring she wished or go the opposite, and be afraid of life. That is in nature of the tone and style of the series.

Peggy's death would impact all the characters, especially Hank and Bobby and would really change the overall tone of the series. It's a comedy that would have to accept the death of such a major character . That would be gutsy. But the only way I'd buy that is if the series goes forward in time-- say a year to two years later. So that King of the Hill can keep its flavor without having to deal with a very depressing issue. However, up to now, I have the feeling that King of the Hill takes place in the present time, so there may be some continuity flaws if any current events were mentioned around the current time (I can't think of any on top of my head, however). Why can't the next season take the current year if Peggy died? Because I know Hank's and Bobby's characters well enough that there could not be much mirth and it's difficult to continue a comedy in that mode. Mike Judge can be morbid in his humour, but this would be too much, it would be at expense of both characters to a degree that is not in style of the show. We care about these characters. They are not Beavis and Butt-Head, which we'd be more distant from.

The other alternative, the dream, would be the easy way out. I hope they would not go there. Buckley's Angel can be bought because of who has seen him. A dream of guilt either by Hank or Peggy would be just plain, bah.

Oh, and another alternative: Peggy could land on George Bush (who just happened to also be skydiving that day). :P

Stormin'

If Judge and the writers have a way out of this that I would actually WANT to see, he can have his grin. All of the solutions offered on this ng so far have the flavor of "here's some wacky way that Peggy can live," or "people sometimes DO survive falls at terminal velocity." None have them have the quality of anything other than a cheap trick.

The writers can do anything with the show they want; it's a work of fiction. They can come back next season with Peggy in the Hill house as usual, the skydiving incident unmentioned, and voiced by a different actress. It would be exceedingly lame, but they can do it - they have the power.

I guess I disagree here. I am trying to respect here the greatness I saw in the season-ending episode. Mr. Valentine and I seem to be the only ones who take what we were shown at face value. Others seem to be in what seems to be the "denial" stage, coming up with all of the fanciful explanations. Remember that the writers specifically showed us what they showed us. I still remember the shock I felt when they actually showed her hitting the ground. Riveting. That ending made what was already a very good episode one of the best season ending episodes I have ever seen of any TV show. Fantastic. I don't want to see that ruined.

If Peggy survives, realistically I suppose she would go through angst or whatnot. The problem is the writers will have lost me, and I will be in disappointment and rolling-of-the-eyes mode. I won't care as much, regardless of what she's going through.

Too far. They may opt not to have a funeral episode, though.

The "style of the show" for me is, along with the hijinks, a show deliberately set in time, place, and reality, much more so that the Simpsons originally was, and light years from where the Simpsons is now. An example would be the episode where Bobby burned down the church, which was quite true-to-life. People die in real life.

Peggy Hill was not a character I was sick of by any means (which makes her death all the more shocking and bold,) but it is possible to have a show without her. You can't kill off Hank because too much of the action revolves around him; Peggy would probably move away or something. Killing Bobby would be too sad. The other characters aren't developed enough to have their deaths be meaningful for more than an epiosde. While Peggy's death will no doubt have a major impact (and also allow more new plot possibilities,) most of Peggy's business related specifically to Hank or Bobby or was self-contained. Other characters will still be around, plausibly, even if Peggy isn't.

Impossible, because both George Bushes live, just like Chuck Mangione. :)

Jay

One little bone o' contention, JayZ755 ( hey, are you related to the
Illinois Z755's? We may be cousins.......). We saw something or someone
fall into the field, but it's impossible to tell with certainty who or
what it was.......coulda been Peggy, or the instructor, or Peggy's
discarded chute or........who _knows_ what.
        We're led to _believe_ that it's Peggy by her suddenly-cut-off
scream and the blood-chilling musical notes immediately
following............if this were real life, that'd be pretty hard to
discount ( even without the music), but, as you point out, this is a
cartoon, and they can do whatever they want. There're _many_ ways they
can weasel out of this predicament.........that's not denial, it's TV
fact.
          They can do whatever they want........obviously, they want us
to spend the summer at least _wondering_ whether Peggy has snuffed it,
but I'm still unconvinced that they'd wanna really do her
in...........the only reason I could see for them wanting to kill one of
the leads off out of the blue like that ( yup, pun definitely intended )
would be desperation over those abysmal ratings.......if that _is_ the
case, and Pegleg _is_ deader'n the ink she's drawn with, we could be in
for one wild season!
         That remains to be seen, though..........................I'm
beginning to get a gut feeling that they may put Peg in a wheelchair.
That'd be a _fairly_ good out.......it would acknowledge that " yes, it
really happened, but, hey, it's a cartoon, so she was 'only' paralyzed
from the waist down.....so sue us if that ain't realistic enough for ya.
Nyaah!" Something like that could even tie in with her efforts to get
pregnant again.......
         We'll just have to see!

Mark2757

( BTW, if anybody from Team KOTH should happen to be droppin' in here for a visit, I can tell ya what'd raise ratings.........heinie, specifically Luanne's. If it works for Dennis Franz, it'll work for Luanne Platter............)

I just hope Peggy just has a near-death expirience and comes back to Hank and Bobby! You're right, if Peggy dies, the impact on Hank and Bobby would indeed change as would the impact on the show, too! I will stop watching KoTH if Peggy ends up dead.

It seems like all my favorite shows have cliffhangers on their season finales, lately. Martial Law had one, and now King of the Hill! (again.) I didn't see the Family Guy season finale, though. Hell, the only show that had a happy season ending so far to me was Futurama!

Re Krispy Kreme, their headquarters is in North Carolina, I
think...........I'm surprised they're not all over Maryland. Shoot, to
hear TV's Rosie talk about 'em, I'm surprised they're not as thick as
McDonald's stands, _everywhere_!
         In fact, after hearin' her wax rhapsodic the other day, I
checked out their website.........it was intriguing, to say the
least..........Elvis had 100 of their donuts backstage at every
concert.........when the first ( or one of the first, anyway )
Chicago-area stand opened, people stood in line for an hour or
more.......to get donuts! When a stand opened in Vegas, it sold ( and
this isn't a typo ) six thousand DOZEN ( yep, 72,000 ) donuts the first
day........I'm surprised they didn't start a riot when they
closed.......or maybe they stay open 24 hours.........anyway, to a
donuthead like me, this is powerful stuff! I _will not_ hop a flight to
Vegas just to get donuts, though.........I WILL NOT!!! ( sob........I
_hope_ I will not..........)
          Now, there's a story idea.....a stand opens in Arlen. Arlen
goes wild. How does Bobby react? As we'd expect.........or maybe not?

BTW, about the cliffhanger, yeah, it'd be one tough spot to get out of. The only escape-hatch I can see is to use the ol' "it was all a dream" gambit..........and what a cheap shot _that'd_ be, eh? Maybe they're gonna put Peggy in a wheelchair for the rest of the series? I think we could live with that..............

Mark Jones wrote:

] Re Krispy Kreme, their headquarters is in North Carolina, I ] think...........I'm surprised they're not all over Maryland.

Sure enough, one of my descendants found a store in Timonium near the state fairgrounds. Krispy Kreme Doughnuts (R). They're good, but I'm not sure any of the King of the Hill characters would drive (or ride a bicycle) more than an hour for a dozen, though.

Thanks.

Hey, they have a store or two in the New Orleans area, too... hmm, is it mere coincidence? Or is it a coverup for the saucer people? 8-)

I've since discovered that they're going to be opening a Krispy Kreme shop in Van Nuys ( about 15 minutes from my house ) soon, so I won't be heading to Vegas for 'em.........whew..............

BTW, Christopher, you know too much......... you'll be hearing from our ( koff ) "people." Keep watching the sky ( that will make it _much_ easier for them to sneak up on you in their shiny black VW...........thanks for your cooperation )

Mark Jones wrote:

If you're lucky, it will be like the Krispy Kreme on Ponce de Leon in Atlanta, where you can actually watch the doughnuts go by on the conveyor belt while you're eating.

Matt Lupo

The fact is that we don't know if Peggy died or not. Also, we don't ] know if the baby is a boy or a girl. We'll find out in the fall.

We saw her hit the ground; we heard the death chords. This isn't like "obvious" running jokes where they've studiously avoided showing us stuff that they show for almost all the other characters. The only cliff-hanger there is whether she knew what was going to happen when she stepped out of the plane.

And the baby can't be anything but a girl.

If Peggy is alive and it's a boy, they will have thrown away hundreds of good plot lines. They're not great on continuity, and they have a history of pulling the audience's legs, but they're not stupid.