1) RnR chemistry--My reaction: I'm happy! 2)JnP chemistry--Did anyone else see a glimpse of a "maybe..."? 3)What happened to Joey's feelings for Rachel??? See...this is exactly like a soap opera...last episode he could barely talk to her and now its like everything is normal and Joey's feelings are gone(as far as I saw). 4)Old Chandler was back! One: the "testicles" joke, and Two: suggesting to punch Monica's parents to make them cry...lol. 5)Alec Baldwin was horrible...way too old and sophisticated to be doing that kind of role...i agreed with that person that said William Baldwin would have been better. 6)Monica's parents are so bad! I have a feeling Monica was "an accident" and thats why they hate her(well they treat her like they do!). 7)Ross was such a sweetie! The description of the proposal was one of the most beautiful moments in Friends history. Ok...now I have no doubt that RnR will be married before the end of the show.
There was closure in 817 as I saw it. The r/j fans will disagree. But Rachel did try and patch things up with Joey and when Rachel queried towards the end, Joey looking forlorn said he's going to be fine. Plus Mon and Chandler tried reassuring Joey that they too have had unrequited love. Perhaps the implicit message is he'll survive.
How much timeline passes between eppies and how long is Joey going to mope around? 2 weeks? 1 mth? 1 year? Or 5 years? I would presume he has already gotten over Rachel.
Another piece of Joey irony:
In season 3 when Ross is jealous over Rachel's co-worder Mark; Ross is agonizing over it with Chandler and Joey at Central Perk. Joey paints a detailed picture of Ross insecurity ending with: "But Rachel and Mark will be there" ... and we say "Get over it! It's been 5 years!"
Just for the record, there are some RnR fans who don't think 817 wasn't real closure. They would like to see a better closure before RnR start lip-locking again. Maybe the RnJ situation come up again in the season 8 finale.
I am still wondering why they made it such a big deal in the past episodes and now it is like no big deal.
BKC were true to their words. There was some closure in 817. Each of us will have will simply have to figure out what that means for ourselves. I do see your point as well as those who have made similar comments. All I see is the creators have kept it implicit. Rachel's feelings can't be too transparent at that this juncture. The fun lies is anticipating what happens next.
And just for the record, r/r have not smooched or are a couple ... yet.
While I can understand that some people think this is enough, I'm not satisfied with the way they have handled Joey's feelings in 817 and 818.
I thought they would at least mention it in some episodes, but Joey has changed overnight, and he is back to square one where he is the funny sidekick who only cares about food. To say that I'm disappointed in this development would be an understatement. Even if we look away from his unrequited feelings for Rachel, it is still obvious that Joey will not be allowed to be on the center stage for the rest of the season. With all the great development we have seen in Joey's character this season, it is sort of a let-down to see that now that May-sweeps is coming up in a few weeks, the writers once again opt for the easy way out ratings-wise; Put some tension between Rachel and Ross. If they do that, fine; but I hope the rest of the episodes will be better than 818 with more focus on all of the characters.
Having said all that, Ross and Rachel were good together in this episode, even though I think it was pretty odd that none of Ross's relatives noticed that Ross and Rachel were not wearing any wedding rings..
Monica was okay, and Chandler had a few good sarcastic one-liners, but it was hardly anything memorable. Although I have to add that the whole "embarrassing speech"-thing was done so much better in 424 TOW Ross's Wedding part 2 when Chandler made a fool out of himself at the rehearsal dinner in London.
I expected Parker to be a funnier character, but he was much better than Jim Nelson, so at least we can be thankful for that. Also, we can be thankful for Phoebe getting a story for a change.
That's regrettable. Maybe they should put Joey's feelings on an expensive frame and hang it on a wall for everyone to see. Or maybe instead of a clip show they can have Joey singing and dancing throughout the next episode about how he's finally over Rachel.
r/r fans will grumble if r/j becomes an item, r/j fans will bitch about "Joey's feelings" when Rachel say nadir and then there are some fans that you just can't please no matter what you do.
Perhaps Rachel should have said yes to Joey and BKC will have an easier time planning out a whole new development for the next 30 episodes where viewers can marvel at how mature Joey has become and how right Rachel is for Joey. Joey will become an excellent father to the baby while Ross spends the next 15 episodes hunting for an albino rat that's rumored to be sighted in the sewer system in his apartment building.
You're right. The next six episodes should be devoted to Joey getting over Rachel. That's much more fun to watch.
You know what? Now I'm keeping my fingers crossed that r/r kiss at the end of 822 winds up on the cutting floor. That would make things more challenging. And hopefully the finale ends with a j/r tension instead.
I agree with that. There's about 30 eppies to go and there'll be equal focus.
It was a fake wedding and they had no idea they had to fake marriage until they got there. I wouldn't be expecting them to be wearing wedding rings and that would make sense.
The filler episodes weren't up to scratch. They hardly have been this season.
I guess having cooled down here is where I apologise for being rude. BKC have already promised they'll send out the characters in style and I'm sure they'll give every character a deserving ending.
I seriously don't know how Joey's feelings should have been handled other than what they have done in 817. A lot of people keep insisting it be dealt but I've yet to hear one plausible idea. Anonymous thinks Joey should "run away" to California. Personally I think that's an awful thing to do to Joey. He becomes a coward and a loser. Yet another idea is he should confront Rachel in the season finale and demand an answer. Joey is now a jerk and will lose all sympathy. Bad idea.
Most of us who have taken enough chances have all visited the crash site of unrequited love. You have to deal with that situation yourself and that's probably what Joey's doing. No where is it written there's a mourning period for it or how long it should be. The dog is dead. Let it rest in peace.
Oh god. *sigh* First of all, I'm not Anonymous, so you can stop "accusing" me of being a JnR fan right away. I just want real closure for a storyline that was pretty important to the show for a while. It was the only thing the promos dealt with from December to March, and now it's gone. Nothing happened. In one episode Joey is devastated and feels awkward around Rachel. The next thing we know he's hardly looking at her, and the only thing he cares about is his food. Where is the talk between Rachel and Ross about how it went at the restaurant? Where is the talk between Ross and Joey as they come to terms with this situation now that they both know that Rachel doesn't love Joey? My point is that the writers spent so much time on the build-up and Joey's feelings that we as an audience deserve something better than this. If they leave it like this, they're sending a message that they can switch storylines at the drop of a hat, and with the enormous momentum and interest this storyline gained, you'd think that they would handle the aftermath better than they're doing at the moment.
disappointed
away
Joey
getting
When did I say that he should be moping around? Joey has been great all season, and I thought he was fabulous even before he fell in love with Rachel. His roommate stories with Rachel were great, and his story with Chandler in 808 TOW The Stripper was among the best stories we've had in a long time.
that
for
<SPOILER FOR 822 SNIPPED>
Why, thank you, thank you very much. You just ruined the next couple of episodes for me. I would have enjoyed seeing the episodes spoiler-free, like I've been doing for the last few years, but no... You just had to put that huge spoiler in your post, huh? So yeah. Thank you, and I'm so "happy" right now.
Of course Ross and Rachel were not thinking of wearing wedding rings when they're not even dating at this point. But I was talking about the people at the party. Shouldn't they be slightly baffled when they noticed that there were no rings on their fingers?
can
Well, the rudeness I can handle, but I still cannot believe you put a spoiler for 822 (!!!) in this post that deals with 818. Ever heard of spoiler space?!? It's common courtesy at ATF.
I can see where you're coming from since you're a fan of RnR, but for the umpteenth time, I'm not a fan of any of these couples, and I still think it's being handled poorly. I was disappointed in both 817 and 818, and with the speed this is going, I'm not exactly looking forward to the May-sweeps episodes. One can only hope that the fact that Joey magically turned into "Food-Joey" is a phase that will be over by the time May comes.
<sarcasm on> Perhaps you'd like to tell me what happens to Joey in May as well? <sarcasm off>
Well, thanks...You actually should take it as a compliment if she did think you were a J&R fan, they typically do not display the sarcastic, petty selfishness in their posts like some R&R fans do. (I sometimes however do get pulled down into that unfortuantely while discussing my point with one of them)
I just want real closure for a storyline
Exactly. That's why I'm confident this will all rehash in the season finale. The relationship between the two, even before 812, has been too much a part of this season for it to just drop off the face of the Earth.
If the writers just dropped it thinking that no one would really care, then they sorely underestimated the impact the story had.
As I've said before, what they are doing now for R&R is I believe is in the end just going to be a catalyst for J&R. For something to happen this quickly after the fact is usually a sign that it's not genuine.
As far as TO In Massapequa goes, since Joey has been dominating the screen time the past 8 episodes, they need to cut down his time in some of these upcoming episodes just so it levels out for everyone. It seems like they didn't want to have much for him to do this episode since next week he might be the focal point again in TOW Joey's Interview.
But personally, I would have liked to see 2 or 3 episodes of Rachel feeling some sort of confusion about why she does not, or can not, have feelings for Joey, or why Joey had feelings for her in the first place. Isn't a woman usually the least bit curious as to why someone falls in love with them?
It's very typical of her to do that. I warn you not to get into discussions with her when the season finale spoiler comes out this weekend.
You might want to define the word courtesy for her in case she's unfamiliar with the term.
So after all those R&R breakups I'm sure you were just expecting them to be completely normal around each other the next episode, right?
"Food Joey" is at least better to watch than "Dumb Joey". It takes no skill on the part of the writers to make a guy look dumb, and it's sometimes painful to watch.
Paul, you should refer to Ganesan(narag) as 'him' since HE is a guy. :)
They kept Joey and Rachel away from each other. I suppose that's an indication that this story is going to continue. They might have aired this episode before 812 and we wouldn't have known. I feel they could have shown one shot of a forlorn Joey when he hears Ross's toast.
If IF they have dropped the storyline, it was a bad way to do it. If its really over, they should have Joey talk to Chandler about how he's handling it.
Yeah, Phoebe got some screen time this week.
Ganesan shouldn't said anything here. I was already spoiled when Paul mentioned the same thing in one of Tennant's threads. :( Really you guys should avoid the temptation to talk about future plots in thread that are specific to one episode.
I don't think we can call him Food Joey here. All he said was that he waited in line for the buffet table. We didn't see him stuffing himself. Joey was a good friend to Phoebe this week giving her some great advice.
On a side to Ganesan: Your arguments would sound more objective if you didn't resort to attacking Joey in your posts. I could accuse you being a Joey basher. ;)
On 1 Apr 2002 22:38:42 -0800, [email] (p r i y a) wrote:
It was not my intention to offend you. Sorry about that. :) My point is that I think it's ridiculous when you feel like the concept of "JnR-fans" and "RnR-fans" has become some sort of an insult. Also, I just wanted to make it clear that I'm not the JnR-fan Ganesan thinks I am.
I agree with the both of you. I have a feeling the writers are holding back something for sweeps. Besides, this episode aired in March; usually a period where *nothing* important happens on the show.
Absolutely. Not to mention the critics who have expressed their interest in this storyline. Having said that, I thought they handled Joey's feelings brilliantly in 812-817.
Anything for another Joey and Chandler scene..
Sadly, the story she got was not good enough. :(
This place usually turns into war-zone from April to May. I remember in 2000 when the ng was invaded by trolls who kept writing "CHANDLER AND MONICA GET ENGAGED IN THE FINALE!!" and "RICHARD RETURNS!!" in the subject lines of their posts just to ruin the finale for everybody else.
Absolutely! When the thread is about 818, it shouldn't be about future episodes, and if the posters are tempted to start discussing spoilers, they should just change the subject line and write e.g. "spoiler for 822" in the subject line.
I thought the jokes in general in this episode were incredibly repetitive.
- Monica has issues with her mom and can never make her happy. - Joey doesn't have much to do and is interested in food. - Phoebe drops hints about how she doesn't like Chandler. (Although Parker did say that he liked Chandler.) - Chandler starts a rant about something feminine. and the result is a joke about him being gay. - Ross is the prince his parents adore. - Rachel wants a big fancy wedding. BTDT...
That's true. Oh well, I guess we were spoiled rotten during Joey's days of glory this season.
Why on earth didn't I realize this spoiler when I read it? I only just noticed it when I read your reply!? Maybe I should consult a doctor... Anyway, the thing mentioned in the spoiler might not be that big a deal, there was a similar scene in 805, which was meaningless, so who knows?
I think the spoiler is true since Ganesan almost seemed to do it on purpose, but then again, it might turn out to be just another "sink-plot." I don't know if you're familiar with the story, but there was a huge, fake spoiler flying around here right before 617 TOW Unagi aired that said that Ross and Rachel were going to get back together in that episode after they fixed a sink. We all know that in the real episode Ross ended up wanting to "attack" Rachel and Phoebe by using "unagi."
I'm sorry by while I noticed the spoiler warning I did not pay attention to the 818 part on the title or on in the message. That was my confusion that resulted in my posting future informaton regarding the show, the veracity of which I can't confirm or ascertain to be the truth.
Once again my sincere, heartfelt apologies to everyone on ATF, most especially to Marita if I have caused any hurt or displeasure at possibly given away information that may have resulted in reduced satisfaction on future episodes.
Some of us like to nitpick over small details. I know many people were bugged that Chandler wasn't wearing his wedding ring in some episodes this season. Nothing wrong in asking about wedding rings especially when Rachel has obviously gone on about a doves placing the ring on her finger!!
You should at least have used ROT13, Ganesan. For those being spoiled by that, may I say that nothing's eaten as hot as it's cooked. When I first read that Joey dates Rachel in season 8 I was still watching season 5 (IIRC) and was spoiled a lot because that wasn't predictable at all. Though I didn't know how far they'd take this story, but even the imagination of them dating made me mad. The incident from the future episode Ganesan mentioned above *is* predictable. Some weeks ago when we were discussing what might happen in the rest of this season this one was the one I was the surest about, except the end of Mona with which I was wrong because she returned after 815. IIRC I put 100� on it.
"Sofya" wrote in message news:a839i5$527$[email]...
Well, Chemistry i dont know, it was probably cause of the moment.
It seemed Rachel were more on to it, then Ross were.
I've looked at every episode now of friends starting from season 1, and
they have always been flirting with eachother more or less. Its a wonder
they havent had been married yet :)
like
Different script-writers?. Seems strange to me too :/
Maybe he has forgot about it, but still.. well maybe next week?
Its not uncommon from what ive seen that some things takes a brake
one week, until it comes back.
that
His first 2 lines were ok, then he got on my nerves.
RnR
Ross saved this episode from being terrible, to being ok :)
But Rachel and Ross, Ross and Rachel.. Rachel and Ross.. Ross and Rachel
:)
Me, too. I was happy not only to see the hint of chemistry but also that they didn't take it too far. As I've said before, it's way too soon for Ross and Rachel be "back together" permanently.
For a sitcom, Friends is very soapy. In this case, though, I think the writers realized that it would have been boring (and kind of out-of-character) to have Joey moping and depressed for an extended period. It's just not his style ... unlike Ross, for example.
Terrible, I agree, through no particular fault of the actor's. The character was a joke (literally) from the beginning. It was disappointing because I was hoping to see Phoebe get a real love interest. It's not like Alec Baldwin is doing much of anything else these days. :-)
I know it's a running joke in the show, but I think it has been a bit overdone to the point where it is as much cruel and sad as it is funny.
He was very sweet and romantic. It was like having the "old Ross" back. I hope this is a trend that continues.
Was anyone else bothered by the fact that Ross and Rachel apparently intend to keep the money they got as presents for their fake marriage? Isn't that kind of unethical? They got those gifts under false pretenses, after all, even though the lie was not originally their fault. Anyway, sooner or later, Ross' parents are going to find out that they're not really married, and R&R are going to look pretty sleazy for keeping that cash.
He didn't even appear to be uncomfortable at a party where Rachel and Ross were posing as a married couple. Even I thought that was odd.
that
character
The joke wasn't very good and it wasn't played out well. This would have worked better if his relentless enthusiasm had been a mask for something else or if it had, to take the opposite tack, had been so genuine and sweet it made them rethink their self-centered cynicism.
and
Well, in this case, Monica's own behavior was so tiresome I finally saw a glimpse into *why*. Mind you, I don't blame Monica for this in particular. Once again, the writers just can't seem to write all six characters well at the same time. This time Ross got the good stuff and Monica got the kind of crap that made Ross so unpopular.
overdone
I also thought that, at least in the case of Jack, her pain was understood and he was trying to correct it. Didn't he give her his car?
hope
Yeah, me too. I ended my boycott for the specific chance of seeing the character Schwimmer played this week.
intend to
kind of
though
parents
to
If this show were generally good about holding Rachel responsible for her actions, I'd be concerned. However, it does seem like generally the only person who ever gets punished for anything is Ross - and since he's on the same side as Rachel this time, this week he got a walk. They might justify it by saying that the money will go to the baby -and believe me, it will. In the real world, I'd be very concerned. In a drama, I'd be concerned. If they weren't having a baby, I'd be concerned. And technically, they did get married once, and now they are having a baby so... bad ethics for life, but it will slide in this particular sitcom because there are some mitigating factors. Now, I could see them milking some comedy out of the fact that they have to keep telling these people they are married... and if they do decide to get married again, I guess they will have to act out that tiny marriage ceremony without any guests because it will have to be a secret!
"abrahammy" wrote in message news:kKnp8.2409$[email]...
like
It's possible that he didn't know for most of the party--we don't see him interacting with them very much. However, upon watching the episode a second time, it struck me as odd that when Ross makes his toast, and refers to Rachel as his wife, the only reaction shot we see is Monica's. You'd think we'd see a doozy of a reaction from Joey. But my theory is that the writers went out of their way to back-burner the Joey/Rachel story in this episode, and thus keep these two characters apart from each other as much as possible.
(Again--if anyone has info on upcoming episodes, please *don't* tell me! I want to be surprised. :) )
My thoughts exactly. They could have aired this episode anywhere before 812 before the J&R plot began. I hope the writers don't think that they given closure for the story (if it's really over) in 817.
Ross was his old wonderful self.
Rachel was a real treat to watch. Did you guys notice the closeup to her reaction when Ross was talking about his proposal. If I was an R&R fan, I'd look at it as major foreshadowing.
Monica was terrible, partly because her actress can't act. Phoebe needs to get a new hairdresser and the 'universe' really needs to find her a better guy.
Joey - Has he got short term memory loss problem? A single shot showing his reaction to Ross's toast isn't too much to ask.
Chandler had very few lines and not too funny.
Alec Baldwin was totally miscast for that role.
The R&R fake wedding story was a blast and the only saving grace for this episode. Very few of the jokes were really funny. They don't write them like they used to. <sigh>
I wonder where they are going with their R&R storyline now. I don't think their story in 818 was what upset Anonymous so much... If something is going to happen between them at least it wasn't because of some other woman Ross was dating (like Mona), so we didn't have to watch "jealous bitchy Rachel" this time around
This story really showed something to me though. If it had been Ross instead of Monica, I think I'd be having a go at the writers again, but since there are only a few episodes where I like Monica, I didn't mind this story at all and enjoyed watching Monica humiliating herself...
I was more than surprised they didn't show Joey's reaction - another indication that this storyline is not over yet
but I think he's doing better in the last couple of episodes than he did for most of the season. The testicle line was ok compared to his S8 standard
Welcome to the club! They should get back some of the writers from the first four seasons - there was always a good few episodes per season that me laugh so hard that I had to stop the DVD to recover... :)
Couldn't agree more. I felt they could have done away with the zesty guy story and devoted more time to the fake wedding plot; like see what the rest of the gang react or have to comment about it. Or even given the Gellers more lines. That could have given 2 plots and would have been markedly improved.
Anyway its been eight years. Gradually changes over time have resulted in a somewhat different show from what was originally conceived even though the cast and BKC are still intact and around. Plus I don't think the the people who were writing season 1 & 2 eppies are still with the show.
Gee, the world I knew is upside down. I thought it was sitcoms that were notorious for having characters snap back to original form when the next episode starts, and I thought soaps were notorious for never ending any sub-plots.
Did someone switch the two while I wasn't looking? I hate it when that happens.
I was referring more to the fact that people fall in and out of love in a blink of an eye on soaps and pretend like nothing happened. Thats what it seems like happened with Joey's feelings for Rachel.
Are you watching British soaps or something? I have been watching soap operas for 8 or 9 years now and this(change of feelings in a blink of an eye) is a major aspect of soaps. Soaps are as far away from reality as it gets...and Friends has been quite a soap since Joey started having feelings for Rachel(from what happened...or rather...did not happen... in 818 I don't think it was love).
"Sofya" a �crit dans le message de news: a839i5$527$[email]...
like
that
and
RnR
i totally agree with you, this episode was one of the most movingf ones and it allows us hoping for a future RnR marriage. Besides, i've seen in the 818 trailer a scene which will probably be in the next episode .. when Ross says: " What would you say if i'd ask you to marry me? ?" ( i'm not sure of the quote but it sounds like this) i don't know what they're going to do with joey's feelings , they can't just passed away like this.. i' quite enjoyed alec Baldwin's part , he was really funny and i loved the way the others laughed at him.! Chandler was in a good mood and he made me so lol !! i really liked this episod !! Will there be another season or is it the end?? coz it will surely end with RnR wedding.. Joey has to find another girlfriend not to being sad at the end.. See ya, xxx Juliette.
PS: i don't know if you understood me everyone but i'm french so pleaz excuse my english!
this just occured to me. Obviously, r and r fans want the show to end with their wedding. And the first episode ever was rachel coming from her wedding from which she fled. So in the last episode, do you think the writers will have her marry ross and say something like "this time i'm not running." Just because it brings closure, and sort of rounds out the show. anyone? anyone?
Well, I'm happy they got a storyline together. I'm happy they didn't go too far by stopping it with the Harley jokes. I'm happy that Rachel seemed to like the idea better than Ross, especially her face when he makes the toast. I'm happy that Ross was Ross and not Mental Geller, even though he was close one time with the Mona line.
Rachel: "That would have been very hard to say 'No!' to." What does this mean in your opinion? How did this sentence continue in Rachel's mind? 1 "...but nevertheless I would have said 'No!'" 2 "...that's why I would have said 'Yes!', although I wasn't sure about it before." 3 "...so I would have said 'Yes!' a) even if you'd asked after we were on a break." b) even if you'd asked today."
I think it's option number 2, maybe 3a.
"maybe they'll be *friends* forever", yes I saw that. :)
That one bothered me too. Joey and Chandler were merely sidekicks this episode, it felt like even the old Gellers had more lines than them, thus there wasn't room for showing them having a talk or Joey being still mad or hunting for R&M female cousins. Maybe this episode should have been a two-parter, i.e. 45 min long, to have enough time to have a fourth plot involving Joey('s feelings) and Chandler and some more details on R&R, like why they were neither wearing rings nor kissing.
The testicle joke was very forseeable, I liked him covering his ears. We've seen much better, i.e. funnier, Chandler action even this season.
I was waiting for a reason for his behaviour all the time, like having cancer or something. After all it gave Phoebe more lines than usual.
Yes, it should have stopped after Ross was mismarried three times and she's having a Disney marriage, maybe when there's finally a grandchild born in wedlock. They didn't react any different than the rest of the audience to Monica's toast after all, although her dad is always a bit phoebesc, i.e. on his own planet (food on sticks, foto of Chi-Chi (sp?)).
It surely was in the Top20, maybe in the Top10, but definetely not in the Top5 -- it might have been if we'd seen it. Now he's to figure out something even more wonderful if he ever wants to propose to Rachel again. I can't await /that/ scene. I also would like to see R&R and maybe the rest of the gang visiting the planetarium for some other reason.
Don't be too sure, yet. I'm believing it ever since TOW the Blackout, though. But I'm aware that belief is neither knowledge nor prophecy.