General Comments on 8.18

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***********spoiler space ends here*********** 8.18 The One in Massapequa

Wow, I'm surprised there hasn't been more commentary on this one yet. . . .

Most of this episode takes place at a reception hall, to celebrate Jack and Judy Geller's 35th wedding anniversary (which establishes their wedding year as 1967, in case it comes up--at least unless the writers decide to shift it!)

Monica

"Competitive Monica" is back for this episode--every year, Ross's anniversary toast is so touching, it makes everyone cry. This year, Monica volunteers to make the toast, and is determined to outdo Ross by inspiring *more* tears. Sadly (but probably not so sad the viewer cries about it), she seems to lose the distinction between choking up because you're touched and crying because someone made you depressed. When her reference to Nana not living to share the occasion doesn't elicit tears, she goes for depressing. . . .

It doesn't help that, at their parents' urging, Ross makes an impromptu toast that has the very effect Monica was seeking.

I guess I found the whole Monica plot a little flat--I think Monica would know the difference between touching and depressing, but maybe one could argue that she panicked.

Phoebe/Parker

Well, once again a love interest is revealed to have a fatal flaw making said love interest undatable. For Parker (Alec Baldwin), it was being ridiculously enthusiastic about *everything*. Some of the funniest moments from this plot came from the others' reactions--e.g. Chandler remarking that his flash hasn't gone off (when Parker does his "mental picture" mime), Ross mimicking him after P. goes off to use the men's room, and Joey avoiding using the men's room just then because he doesn't want Parker to express his admiration. . . .

In a way, I'm tired of the dismissing-a-love-interest-due-to-flaw device, but I also got some giggles out of the over-the-top story. "Don't let the best door in the world hit your ass on the way out!"

Ross/Rachel

Judy and Jack reveal that they have been giving people the impression that Ross and Rachel are married, and Judy urges them to play along. Both are initially uncomfortable with the idea of lying, but soon Rachel begins to enjoy telling outlandish stories about their imaginary wedding, and before long Ross is enjoying their deception, too--as well as the gift checks people keep handing him.

Here we have another instance of Rachel (and this time, Ross, too) benefiting from a lie. It's true that they were hoodwinked into participating in the lie, but their misgivings were short lived.

Ross's sweet engagement story--and Rachel's reaction to it--seemed to throw some hope to viewers who might be wishing for them to end up back together. But the writers pulled back from that conclusion--at least for now--by giving Ross the line that it's a good thing he didn't end up proposing since the wedding (e.g. the outlandish fantasy Rachel painted at the reception) would have been sooooo expensive. It seems to me the writers kept things very much up in the air. (Full disclosure: I'm an R & R fan from way back, but right now I just want a good story that does the characters justice--whatever direction the writers decide to take).

Joey and Chandler don't have much to do in this episode, besides one-liners and general support. I couldn't help noticing that Joey and Rachel are decidedly separate during the episode--probably so that the writers can hold off on advancing that storyline for the moment. (Note: I'm staying spoiler-free, so please, no disclosures from people who know what's coming).

Belphoebe

finally, another R and R storyline. I thought their chemistry was (as usual) right on, and when ross was describing his proposal, think we all got a little hopeful that something might come of it when we saw rachel's face. But sadely, as it was said, the writers pulled back (as usual) when they could have had a very romantic lead in to the R and R reunion. Obviously, I'm still very hopefull.

"Belphoebe" wrote in message news:Db4p8.4265$[email]...

.

Boy, I sure noticed that too. Three hours after the show there where only a few new threads, and two of them where mine! I was itchin' for some dialogue, but I decided to rewatch the ep instead.

and

year

Monica

touched

And Mr. Geller wishes Nana were there to have heard Ross's toast, although nobody appreciated the thought when Monica mentioned it in her toast.

moments

that

Ross

his

Odd that his fatal flaw is enthusiasm, but I'm sure few would doubt it is a flaw--a big fat, outrageous flaw.

throw

together.

I liked it, but of course, they are dragging it out a bit.

since

back,

That is exactly where I am at with it--go where ever you want with the storyline, but make it believable and true to the characters involved.

one-liners

hold

coming).

In article , "David Buehrle" writes:

Some of us didn't get a chance to watch it until now.

The problem with Monica was that she specifically *trying* to bring tears. She got what she deserved on that one, though I can understand her frustration. This is one of those places where competitiveness is counterproductive. Notice how Ross had to be coaxed into making an impromptu toast? Makes a world of difference.

Frankly I thought there were a few funny moments, but overall I hated the whole sub-plot with a passion. It was such an over-blown caricature, and maybe it's just been done too much already. I was just like Joey and Ross and Chandler and Rachel and Monica in my reaction to Mr. Ultra-Positive-To-A-Fault. And while it is fun to be able to identify with these characters every once in a while, I'd like it to be a lot more realistic and interesting and a lot less shallow.

"JamesS1889" wrote in message news:[email]...

although

She

frustration.

Notice

of

Yes, this is what I was thinking when I wrote that Monica seems to lose the distinction between "touching" and "depressing." She wants to elicit tears, no matter what it takes. I think when Chandler covers his ears, he's sort of a stand-in for us, the viewers. It was like, "please, make it stop!" :)

a

whole

it's

Chandler

And

a

less

You know, this Enthusiasm Boy that Baldwin plays in 8.18 reminded me in some ways of the over-the-top French-teacher character he has played a couple of times on _Saturday Night Live_. I think he must get a kick out of playing cartoonish characters like that. But I agree, it was a bit much.

tired

Yes, I doubt anyone really expected Phoebe *not to* grow tired of him, and I prefer to be surprised--at least a *little bit*.

Belphoebe

"Belphoebe" wrote in message news:B7op8.3855$[email]...

tears.

the

tears,

:)

Oh yes, exactly. I could almost hear those exact words from his head. It was a very Chandler moment. (Wow, how's that for turning a noun into an adjective?)

is

some

of

I

I realize they can't surprise us every time, and still be true to the characters, but I do agree that they have been able to do it a lot so far this season. I have loved so much of this eighth season, especially "TOW The Videotape," which is a personal fave for the season.

"David Buehrle" wrote in message news:rAsp8.39903$[email]...

Buehrle"

sort

It *was* very Chandler. And hey, verbing nouns, adjectiving nouns, nouning verbs; if you can make it work, it's all good! In _Gravity's Rainbow_, Pynchon uses "paranoid" as a verb: "Slothrop paranoids from door to door looking for one that might have something to tell him." I love that! :)

and

I agree about the season in general and "Videotape" in particular. I like how the writers set up their surprise with Joey's seduction story, which seems like a throwaway moment, until. . . . :)

Belphoebe

some

of

Funny, because I read some of the spoilers before actually watching the episode, and I was nicely surprised by the Baldwin character. Let me express my point of view, and sorry if my english is not correct, as it is not my mother tongue.

Friends is a sitcom, it's not about real life. We often see some extreme situations, pushed furthermore beyond the boundaries of common sense. This is what happens with Parker (Baldwin). His "unrealistic" behaviour has to be seen as more than just a caricature. Whenever there's a famous guest star in Friends, they tend to show him/her first of all as an actor/actress who's having fun on the set and is happy to be a part of the show. Remember Phoebe's line to Will (Brad Pitt)? "Oh, come on, Will, take off your shirt and tell us." and "(while hugging him) Just how I imagined it would be". Those, and especially the last one, are clearly examples of some "private jokes" related to the fact that Pitt is a gorgeous man, but has nothing to do with his character. Same happens when Aniston touches Bruce Willis' chest for the first time, and add the line "Wow, those are great!"...

The fact that Parker seems to already know everyone ("Typical Ross!") is leading me to think that the writers wanted us to see Baldwin's character more like a guy, a big fan, coming to the set, and kind of losing touch with reality, starting to believe he's actually part of the story and that he's talking to the real Chandler, the real Ross, etc. (like in Nurse Betty).

And I think this is a regular thing in Friends: the mix between the story in the show and the show itself (George Clooney and another guy from E.R. acting as doctors, is another good example).

/Faskil.

"Faskil [BNG]" wrote in message news:YMsp8.3$[email]...

Same happens when Aniston touches Bruce Willis' chest

Can you explain that line? I mean I know that she is talking about his "big" pecks but does this line come from one of Bruce Willis' movie?

Sofya

"big"

No, but when you look closely at the scene, the way she says that, it's obvious the line was not written, but was probably some private joke intended to make Willis "crack" (same goes for Kudrow's lines in the episode with Brad Pitt).

"Faskil [BNG]" wrote in message news:rGvp8.18$[email]...

episode

Hm, I don't think there's anything about the line or its delivery that marks it as obviously unscripted. If I had to guess, I'd be more inclined to believe the lines you cite were all part of the scripts. Though perhaps you're on to something in that the lines were written to allude somewhat to the guests' star status? I don't know--it's not something I'd thought about before.

Your theory about Alec Baldwin's Parker character as a kind of fan stand-in was interesting. However, my take on his knowing about all of the characters in the beginning was that he'd pressed Phoebe to tell him *all* about them, and he'd committed it all to memory. That and his desire for instant intimacy with the group seemed to me elements of that over-the-top enthusiasm we've been discussing.

One thing weighing against your theory about Parker is that, since die-hard fans of the show tend to be fairly adamant about how they want things to go, I'd expect a fan-manqu� to grill the characters with lines like:

"Ross! Rachel! On again, off again, on again. Love, hate, indifference, friendship, lust, baby. What's it gonna BE?!? Wouldja stop jerking us around?"

"Joey! What are you going to do about Rachel?"

"Monica, Chandler--would you branch out and do something *interesting*?"

You know, the sort of stuff that goes on here in ATF. :)

Belphoebe

"Belphoebe" wrote in message news:LKGp8.1620$[email]...

die-hard

go,

LOL! They should actually have a guest star like that, that'd be such a blast :)

Andre

"Andr� Knoche" wrote in message news:a87fcp$r0$[email]...

Hee hee. Maybe next season, in a sort of alternate-universe episode. ;)

Belphoebe

marks

to

about

I don't know. I watched it again and I came to that conclusion because the way JA is telling the line just seems so unrehearsed. I think there are a lot of "unscripted" moments in Friends. Think about that one when Joey is telling Rachel his "moves", and he messes up with the fork saying "See, I couldn't even get through with that one..." or something like that. It looks like it wasn't scripted, not in the way ML performed it...

stand-in

Yep, it makes sense too. Anyway, yours or mine, I liked the Parker characted very much, because he was so "out of this world" and I think IMHO that Friends has been lacking some of those "unbelievable" or "unreal" moments lately...

die-hard

go,

They could've. And in my opinion, it would've make Parker even more funny. :-)

/Faskil.

"Faskil [BNG]" wrote in message news:S8Ip8.131$[email]...

looks

*all*

for

over-the-top

characted

indifference,

I did not think he was funny. I had no reaction to him. The only line that was remotely funny IMO was the "best door in the world" line.

Sofya

funny.

that

Don't get me wrong, but I like it better when the writers go in that direction, instead of setting some really uninteresting plots about serious love affairs between Friends. The show is a sitcom, and it was turning into a soap. I seriously hope we're done with the J&R thing, as well as with the R&R thing (that storyline had its time, more than necessary), and that the writers will stop trying and surprise us with some really unexpected cliffhanger for the ending of season 8, and get back to the business of making us laugh.

/Faskil.

In article , "Faskil [BNG]" writes:

I disagree completely. There is absolutely no reason they can't do both at the same time, and I don't see this sitcom coming anywhere close to being a soap. In my opinion, they *are* doing both right now.

at the

soap.

I didn't say they "can't" do both at the same time, I just find it personally annoying, since it's not the reason I started to watch the show a few years earlier. Until now, the J&R situation has been a complete waste of time, because it didn't lead anywhere, and it was not interesting. The only scene worth it was the one where Joey & Rachel told each other their "moves" (and it could've happened in a totally different context). Maybe the next episodes are gonna prove me wrong (i.e. it's actually leading to something interesting, relevant to the show) but as far as I can tell from the spoilers, it's not gonna happen.

I've been so bothered by the Chandler proposal scene at the end of the sixth season, I don't wanna have to run through this kind of thing one more time...

/Faskil.

"Sofya" wrote in message news:...

Bruce Willis guest starred in Friends for three episodes in late season six. He won an Emmy for his performance. The above dialogue IIRC comes from TOW Ross meets Elizabeth's dad.

Priya

"p r i y a" wrote in message news:[email]...

news:...

"big"

OMG! I saw that episode BUT I was talking about that line in general...just because someone asks to explain a line doesn't mean they haven't seen the episode. Every time I watch it I don't get that line...i thought it came from a Bruce Willis' movie. Thanks for explaining it Faskil.

Sofya

"Sofya" wrote in message news:...

You have in the past asked about many episodes that you hadn't seen. Thats why I 'wrongly' assumed you hadn't seen this one.

Priya

"David Buehrle" wrote in message news:G0dp8.32609$[email]...

.

a

Funny you should say that--I rewatched it yesterday. :)

I know--poor Mon. And it was a pleasure to see nice-guy Ross in the tag, telling her that *he* appreciated her toast.

device,

the

a

I know, how true. And Phoebe clearly found his enthusiasm attractive at first--if only he had "an edge," as Joey notes regarding Pheebs.

They definitely are, and I think many of us are wary, based on past experience. . . .

reception)

things

Right, I hope the writers don't decide to sacrifice any of the characters (metaphorically, of course!) on the altar of sitcom devices.

Belphoebe

"Belphoebe" wrote in message news:Db4p8.4265$[email]...

.

Some more thoughts on the episode (re-watched it):

- Why is Joey "sniffing the fart" during Monica's toast? At least it seems to me like he is...

- How dumb are all the guests to buy Rachel's story about the wedding? *maybe* the location, but Stevie Wonder singing, I suppose that was some really big photographer she mentioned making the pictures, blind nuns making her *whatever* (cant remember what she said), an engagement ring the size of her fist?? Hellooo, this is Rachel Green not Jennifer Aniston we're talking about :-) And don't give me plot device again, that was just pushing it too far

- And Alec Baldwin did one funny thing: "look at that plate bouncy thing" *lol* kinda reminds me of some of my friends :)

- Another contender for best line of the episode: "You are like Santa Claus on Prozac... at Disneyland... geting laid!" *g*

Andre

.

making

of

talking

Claus

Forgot this one: - When Parker punches Chandler, doesnt it sound a lot more realistic than a movie punch normally does?

Andre

"Andr� Knoche" wrote in message news:a8a6va$29$[email]...

.

Well, he *did* suggest that he'd be using his acting techniques. Maybe that was all he could think to do when the tears weren't coming. :)

Yes, Annie Leibovitz is a pretty big deal. :)

<< http://kultura.gratex.sk/krajcovicova/leib/annie_a.htm >>

she mentioned making the pictures, blind nuns making

of

talking

I know what you mean, but I could forgive the outlandishness because it was such silly fun. But yes, the guests by all rights shouldn't have believed it. . . .

That was cute--though it did seem he was beginning to grate on Phoebe just then. :)

Claus

I loved that line, too--especially the way Phoebe built it piece by piece.

Belphoebe

"Belphoebe" wrote in message news:...

hehe. That was classic Joey. It was fun to watch unlike that toast.

As they were building up their fantasy wedding, I was thinking of Jen's very expensive wedding myself. I'm sure many of those guests knew she was exaggerating.

Although Baldwin was supposed to give Phoebe a story, she didn't seem fully into it, if not bored by it. She seemed kind of distracted. I've not counted but this must be Phoebe's umpteenth boyfriend who's had a 'flaw' that she's oblivious to till the end. After eight years, she gets the same old storylines. <sigh>

Priya

"p r i y a" wrote in message news:[email]...

news:...

I also thought of the real-life Aniston-Pitt wedding. :)

True, and if they weren't already suspicious, Rachel shushing that one guest because she "want[s] to hear" Ross's engagement story is probably a big clue.

I know, as I've mentioned in another post, I also think this method of disposing of a love interest has been overused. Hank Azaria, where are you when we need you?!?

Belphoebe

"Belphoebe" wrote in message news:...

Maybe it was an in joke on JA's wedding.

Not to mention the ring that was the size of her fist! :)

Yep. Maybe we'll see him next season.

Priya

"p r i y a" wrote in message news:[email]...

news:...

Could be. :)

guest

True. Then her finger broke off and she had to have it reattachd (taking the invented story to its logical conclusion). ;)

you

I hope so. Since it's going to be the last season, maybe the writers could get HA to commit to a longish arc that has Phoebe and David ending up together. And it would make psychological sense if it were suggested that, on some level, she's been holding out for him since he left for Minsk.

Belphoebe

"Belphoebe" wrote in message news:hx_q8.1044$[email]...

big

are

could

that,

Wasn't he only supposed to be gone 2 years? It seems like it was more than 2 years from when he left to his brief visit. How much longer do you suppose they'll let him stay in Minsk?

"David Buehrle" wrote in message news:In8r8.17293$[email]...

more than

I could be wrong, but I thought there was some reference to the research being delayed?

Belphoebe

"Belphoebe":

Hm, just noticed, that we -- or at least they -- should have seen Richard there, because he's one of Jack's best friends. But it seems as if party invitations are always sent out without a plan in Friendsworld: e.g. Mona at Mondler's wedding, but not Gunther, who's been around at Halloween and the 2 parties.

Christoph

"Christoph P�per" wrote in message news:a8hg0v$2ekv$[email]...

and

Oh, I hadn't even thought of Richard. Maybe we're supposed to assume he stayed away because it's too painful for him to see Monica married to someone else? Or the writers didn't want us to think of him. :)

Belphoebe

"Belphoebe" wrote in message news:oz_q8.1054$[email]...

Jack

Or maybe he was in Barbados getting married to the new love in his life. <evil grin>

I haven't read enough of the archives to know if this has been discussed (y'all are prolific!) but any episode that features Jack & Judy is one that I will avoid. I absolutely cannot stand those people, and don't know why in the world Monica even bothers.

It's not even funny, just painful!

Deb

"Deb" wrote in message news:[email]...

. .

and

year

shift

Monica

inspiring

it),

touched

Nana

would

LOL I just love them--well I love to hate them--or something like that. Anyway, I can really see a lot of his dad in Ross.