Ross'n'Rachel in the Guardian Guide 12th Feb

Feb 15, 200016 posts by 7 posters
16 posts
Jacqui

extracted... it's a long article and I can't find it online.

"Television has a very different agenda and the couples on it carry a burden that has more in common with Brecht than with Bochco. The end must never come, happy or otherwise. A storybook ending is not in the script. For Ross and Rachel... the job is to keep the plates and plots aloft season after season... mating on prime-time runs the same risk that it does for lower orders of insects: get it on and die.

It is nearly impossible to think of a long-running show that doesn't depend on a grippingly untable, thrillingly disfunctional, non-starting couple as its comic or dramatic kingpin. And the most robust thwarted romance currently perplexing the comedy nation is the one, or rather the one not, between Friends Ross and Rachel. If ever there was a ludicrous spinning of the wheels of sexual tension this is it. Don't get me wrong, the pair were, and in many ways still are, ideal TV soulmates. Their romance pre-dates the start of the show, with a high-school crush; one or both of them spent week after wearying week on the rebound from each other; they deluded themselves into loving tedious outsiders (a prime stalling tactic); they practised denial with a skill that was nothing short of presidential; but the want in their eyes registered with the force of a cyclone. Then it happened. We made it to the summit. They gave in to their desires. Which meant of course that if anyone was going to keep watching they had to be broken up, and soon. The reason for their sundering was even less likely than any of the million ploys to keep them apart. A weak-willed fight. And now we are back at the base camp of bad timing, unreturned affection, lovesick desperation. As one former Friends producer says "They'll never touch that one again". Yeah, and no one was ever going to turn a dime on the internet.

How then to explain the show's healthy, uncomplicated, sweet and downright normal (for TV) merging of Monica and Chandler? By all laws of sitcom science their courtship should not have been so swift, nor their union so easy, so right. Perhaps they are more like the viewer than their haircuts and decorating would suggest. The vicarious kicks of watching others drop in and out of the love parade may actually pale compared to the drama of our own lives. We might prefer narratives that have a prayer of turning up on our own shabbier doorsteps. Let's face it, in the real world we want to fall in love like we're falling down a flight of stairs. No one really likes to work for it."

Jac (I like the line about haircuts and decorating)

I resemble the lines about haircuts

(speaking of which...)

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Tennant StuartJacqui

In article , "Jacqui" wrote:

Is this whole of the "Friends" part of the article?

Brecht & Bocho? (heard of both, but that's as far as I go.)

Keep the plates and plots aloft ? (apart from context - que?)

I Love Lucy, Bewitched, Taxi, Roseanne, Seinfeld, Mad About You...

LOL

a) THEY WERE ON A BREAK!

b) HE DIDN'T TRUST HER!!

(choose one)

Ahhh, so this is why I'm a C&M fan, it's healthy...

Me too. Thanks for that Jacqui, a lot of hard typing. :)

A show with more than one couple can afford to have its cake & eat it.

Tennant

Greetings to family, friends, and neighbours from [email]

Lol, exactly... I would have been drivin off the edge If I stayed a big Ross and Rachel fan, because they treat the Ross and Rachel fans like a ping-pong ball through the whole thing! Really, Guys, Hang in there... It'll happen.

*Clinging to the computer desk, Ashley*

Unfortunately there's not too many clues to go by. This week's episode wont help at all, and with the negotiations for next year not going anywhere, i don't think even the production staff knows where its going. I think they want to put them back together, but i don't think they know how to do it without being cliched.

Meanwhile in the C&M camp i believe we're at a significant milestone. I think we're either at or past the number of episodes that R&R lasted

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Claire AbrahamWilliam Pora

Oh, you are past. You went past some time ago.

Tennant StuartWilliam Pora

In article , William Pora wrote:

Long past - C&M exceeded R&P at the start of S6.

Tennant

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Tennant StuartPeachLilli

In article ,

Eek! From Brechtian Analysis to Freudian Slip!

Yes indeed, wrong hat Larissa, well it was only � of a letter!

Err - C&M exceeded R&R at the start of S6. (blushes)

Many thanks, Tennant. :)

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JacquiTennant Stuart

Tennant Stuart wrote

Yes, the rest is Mulder and Scully, Frasier/Cheers, NYPD Blue, - interesting but not really relevant to this ng.

Jac

Steven Bochco - producer of shows like NYPD Blue, LA Law, Hill Street Blues, The Invisible Man, and many more. Brecht I don't know about.

Larissa

JacquiPeachLilli

a

Blues,

Bertolt Brecht 1898-1956, playwright, writer of "The Caucasian Chalk Circle". Founder of a whole stream of "modern" plays. An Expressionist. Major concept of his work - you have to see the actors being actors, not characters, you have to see the stage as a set not reality. Hard to explain on a ng, really. :)

Jac

Tennant StuartJacqui

In article , "Jacqui" wrote:

Thanks Larissa, and to Jacqui for this...

Okay, but could you explain to a humble engineer how couples on television carry a burden that has more in common with Brecht than with Bochco?

BTW, just looked Brecht up on the IMDb, and one title caught my eye immediately - "Die Rache des Kapit�ns Mitchell".

"Rache" is the German word for revenge/vengeance/retaliation/nemesis.

Ooo err! Tennant :)

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JacquiTennant Stuart

Tennant Stuart wrote

carry

television

Ok. In your average TV show (with an average TV audience, not an analysing one like atf), characters are characters. You follow their lives, you don't analyse what should happen, you just go with the flow. On Bochco shows the action and plots are so good that you don't stop and acknowledge that it's just tv, you're hooked in there. What the writer is saying is essentially that shows like Frasier and Friends depend much more on the quality of dialogue and the temperament of characters, as they are not all-action. Therefore couples must follow a story dynamic that in an intelligent audience leads us to a Brechtian analysis - they *must* get together, or they *must* be kept apart, to fulfill the requirements of story arcs and character traits. We all know that Rachel must "love Ross, hate Ross, love Ross", which when we acknowledge that knowledge (IYSWIM) is a Brechtian trait. We KNOW they are characters in a show, we KNOW how they ought to behave, and we KNOW when they don't behave true to type, out of character, outrageously, however you want to put it. But at the same time we all KNOW it's the writers doing it to them, it's not just that Ross and Rachel are two irritating people.

Jac (there's a lot more to it than that but I'm not going to start explaining the entire basis of literary theory right now.) ;)

Tennant StuartJacqui

In article , "Jacqui" wrote an explanation that was exactly the right length, while warning there's a lot more to it than that, but she's not going to start explaining the entire basis of literary theory right now...

That was just great Jacqui, thankyou *so* much - and to think we all indulge in Brechtian analysis!

Nicest thing anyone's said to me all day... :)

Tennant

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There are lots of things that have been said about Friends that can be taken in very different ways. It just depends on the context that a certain quote is placed in, i've learned not to trust these things, for they always just tease. I've personally enjoyed waiting for a good Ross and Rachel moment more than being satisfied with what the writers are giving us instead with Monica and Chandler. I've got large lung capacity, i'll keep holding my breath. =)

Adriana

Ross: I don't know if anything is ever going to happen with us again, ever, but I don't want to know that it never could. So I stopped it, and she got mad and broke my projector. -TOW Chandler Can't Cry