701 & 702, Part 1

S E A S O N

7

S P O I L E R

S P A C E

Well, I saw both new episodes this evening. In my opinion, the season premiere was a huge disappointment, but the second episode was actually quite enjoyable.

First, TOW Monica's Thunder…

I was pleased that the episode took off where the season finale left off, and Ross' absence was explained. However, right off the bat, Monica ruined this episode. After a positive change in her behavior late last season, she appears to have reverted to her screechy, early Season 6 personality. Her screaming from the balcony was ridiculous and her treatment of Rachel was completely uncalled for. Throughout the episode, I found myself siding with Rachel and totally disliking Monica.

However, my main problem was R&R. It's nice the writers haven't forgotten R&R, but the situation was handled terribly. Now, I didn't expect a reunion, and I didn't actually expect Wanda's "big surprise" to come true. Yet, I still hoped the episode would at least be a positive note for the R&R relationship. Boy, was I wrong. There were many reasons I was annoyed….

1)R&R's hallway kiss: It was never properly explained or resolved. The kiss should have never happened if it wasn't going to be addressed and dealt with. Rachel, especially, did not seem to care it even happened.

2)R&R's hallway conversation: I found it hard to believe that Rachel could not find anything good to say about her relationship with Ross. I mean, they ONLY spent a year together. Are the writers changing history again by saying the main reason Rachel stuck by Ross was because of his hands? In my opinion, this was the writers' way of saying that C&M are the real deal, and R&R were nothing.

3)R&R's "reunion": After leading Ross on, Rachel treated him like garbage. Ross appeared seriously interested in getting back together. Rachel should have noticed this and politely reasoned with him. Instead, she continues to lead him on until the final scene, where Ross finally gets the message. There is nothing left open regarding the R&R relationship. It appears the writers have no interest in getting them back together, and there is nothing for the R&R fans to look forward to this season. The writers seem to be betting all of their money on C&M's engagement. We'll see how the ratings hold up when November comes along.

Also, it was pleasant to see some C&J interaction, although the focus was mainly on Chandler. The scene where Joey reveals Chandler's problem to the group was the funniest moment of show. I only wish Chandler had more scenes with Joey and less with Monica. But I will give the writers some credit for pulling out the big guns for this season premiere----there was plenty of C&J, R&R, and C&M action for everyone. (On another note, this subplot should resolve any mystery behind Chandler's comment at the end of TOW The Jellyfish.)

Finally, there was Phoebe. Her songs were cute, but her personality hasn't improved. She is the same annoying Phoebe that lurked throughout Season 6. I found myself wondering why the group is still friends with her.

Overall, I'd give this episode a C+. It was quite average in my opinion and only had a few high points.

I might also add that the appearances of the cast members have changed once again. I have not been attracted to CCA since Season 3, but I thought she looked great in this episode. Her hair finally looks decent, and she's actually tanned. JA and LK looked the same, except JA's hair is a couple inches shorter. I can't wait to see her new haircut. DS and MLB also appeared the same, although DS is back to his early "greasy" hairdo. I think everyone will agree that MP has changed the most. He has lost a ton of weight and is now as skinny as ever (excluding Season 3). But his hair needs to be shorter to match his now thinner face. From what I've heard, it only gets longer.

Anyway, since this post has stretched out longer that planned, I'll save 702 for a separate post.

--Doc

I agree.

Me too, Monica was awful. I don't see why anyone wouldn't though, Rachel wasn't doing anything wrong by Monica.

I think it was positive...

It shows that they are still attracted to each other at least. They both pretended it was nothing afterwards. Look how little it takes to get them kissing, just a few moments of conversation and...

Yup. They have to beat it into peoples heads.

Hmm, she just wanted sex, and made it perfectly clear to him about that. This story disturbed me because of the lack of emotion between them, and Ross' feelings were far from being hurt. (his pride OTOH...) Ross would have had a good time as well, and he tried the same thing last year.

Did we watch the same episode? He just seemed horny to me. The only moment of feeling between them was in the hallway. (I liked the look in Rachel's eyes just before it cut away) It was killed by Monica's interruption and shrouded in denial for the rest of the episode.

She didn't seem to be leading him on to me. She made it prettty clear that his chances were nil after MOnica found out. Except with the "Come on Ross, lets go have sex!" line.

Yup. I see a big ratings fall myself...

Great stuff, IMHO.

Yeah, I liked that Bing wont sing song though.

Indeedio.

Great.

I'll have to review my tape, but I'm pretty sure at one point Ross does tell Rachel they should discuss what happened in the hallway. But she doesn't seem interested.

You are correct, though. Most of the episode, Ross was portrayed as horny.

--Doc

SPOILERS...

I would have to agree, the season premeire was not that great, Monica was unbeleivably annoying and rude towards Rachel and very selfish to boot, Monica and Chandler are definetly looking older though, so I suppose Joey trying to play a 19 year old was a little in joke perhaps because they are really looking older than the ages they are playing...

"TXHorns79" wrote in message news:[email]...

Monica

to

looking

I got to say that the ONLY way I would agree with Monica being such an annoying &$%#! is if it had been her wedding day. Since this was just her engagement night I think she totally overreacted but I also got to say that I think that the R&R fans got so cheated last night. When are they going stop this teasing? I know that for me I would love to see them get back together and to see them kissing and then see them just blow it off as nothing kills me! And was it just me or did Matthew's head look weird in the first show? I've watched it twice but I still can't pinpoint it.

You don't think that Rachel was equally as bitchy? She was the one who wouldn't let it go, and Monica was the one who eventually went over to apologize. Besides we've seen this before..oh let's say in the moving out ep. Rachel & Monica act like bitches, then are the best of friends again at the end of the ep.

I thought that Joey's 19 thing was pretty dumb. I guess Joey wasn't too confident in the success of Mac & Cheese.

Overall though I enjoyed the episodes..Ross just seems to be getting funnier. We got to see Phoebe playing her guitar again. Monica's parents explaining what they did w/ her wedding fund. Monica eventually giving in and deciding she didn't want Chandler to spend all the $ on a big wedding. I really enjoyed 7.02 as well..all the storylines worked well.

====== es*o*ter*ic b : of or relating to knowledge that is restricted to a small group

2 a : limited to a small circle

No. I liked her in these episodes. I hope she stays like this all season. Monica would be better off falling off that balcony.

Rachel was trying to figure out why her "best" friend was angry with her. She spent most of the episode repeatedly apologizing to Monica for something she didn't mean to do, and was none of Monica's business to get angry about in the first place.

She went over to tell Rachel that she would purposely ruin Rachel's "engagement night" by announcing her pregnancy. Rachel practically groveled (at the wrong Geller) and showed how much of a hypocrite Monica would be if she didn't apologize. Only then did Monica apologize.

Monica was more at fault there as well.

Y'know, I've heard that some actors have more than one job at a time.

Fine that's your opinion, but I think it would be better for everyone if people kept character slams at a minimum. I happen to like Monica and it's irritating to read all this stuff about how people hate her. I like her, and I think a lot of people do too. I bet if I made some comments about someone besides Ross or Monica I'd get flamed like crazy.

I thought Monica had some valid points, although she was pretty unreasonable. Still Rachel was adding fuel to the fire and couldn't let it got either.

That's pretty much your opinion, I don't really agree. How could Rachel not be at fault? She didn't even pack and manipulated Monica into packing her stuff by saying it was a gift.

Yeah but usually not unproven actors. I dont think the producers would want people to identify their lead as that dog food guy or whatever.

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On 16 Oct 2000 01:23:43 GMT, [email] (EsotericGrrrl) wrote:

Ehh, we're still talking about fictional characters, right?

On this newsgroup, its hard to tell.

I think what 701 did was capture the conflict between fans of the show perfectly.

the C&M fans that feel that their couple gets slighted by the R&R fans who keep hoping their couple will make a comeback and joey and phoebe off to the sides basically acting as window dressing.

Who knows, maybe this is the writers way of indirectly commenting on the fans of the show

if people

irritating

think a lot

Ross or

True. And also, isn't it possible that Monica, the character, is *supposed* to have the sides many or some of you hate because that just *is* her personality. I mean, who says all characters in a show have to be likable. Everything Monica does *is* Monica. Do you really want to see a show where everyone always makes the right decisions, always does the right thing, never does anybody wrong, always is considerateos other people, etc. Of course I know you don't but some posts are just so patronizing and judgmental. In the sense of "That was wrong, this is good". And that is wrong. *irony alert*:) Anyway, I have to calm down now :)(wax on, wax off, wax on, wax off,...)

Cihan.

[email] wrote:

No, of course not. But there's a reason why Phoebe and Joey don't cause this kind of reaction, and why everybody loves Chandler, who is very flawed, so much. What they've done to Monica here is worse than what they did to Ross in season five for two reasons:

1. Monica has to carry the show's most important storyline, which is a story we are supposed to caare about.

• Monica is presumed by the writers to be justified.

Ross' story was peripherial and it was a given we were supposed to think he was a dork.

On Fri, 13 Oct 2000, DocDoc2222 stated this considered view. Waking from my doze, I hastily scrawled -

I guess being around a hottie like Rachel does that to a guy! :)

I'll have to review my... memory. Do you mean when Rachel was standing in her room, and Ross sticks his hands in the door and says "Guess who?" I think that entrance sums up what he wanted from her.

That's all I saw in him.

I saw that in a slightly different way. After Ross' entrance, he says something along the lines of "we kind of left something up in the air out there." The question is, was he refering to the kiss or the "bonus night?" I thought he was talking about the kiss at that moment. But later it seems all he can think about is the sex. So, I could be wrong. Either way, I think it was poor writing, since the kiss was never addressed again or explained properly.

--Doc

DocDoc2222 wrote:

There's always a substantial chance that segments of the story got left on the cutting room floor, too. He wanted her to mention something good about their time together. Sex was all she could think of, and sex is what he focused on because that's what she focused on.

that's a good point. Maybe the whole "Rachel's secret" thing got cut....

Was this before or after he started to take off his tie? All I can remember of this exchange is:

Rachel: <something about Monica's behavior> Ross: Who cares? Rachel: I care! Ross: And so do I! (re-tightens tie)

Classic fake sympathy. :)

That is true... I would have liked a little scene between R&R after the Rach&Mon scene, settling the issue of the day. Something like "Sorry about the whole non bonus night thing, and not remembering anything good about being with you. All I could think about was your, uh, handshake. ...and hey, I bet I'll be super depressed when Monica's wedding finally rolls around. ;);)"

Of course, there's lots of stuff that I would have changed about this episode. The jokes were really on for a change, but the drama was shallow. Same with the second episode, but there was comparatively little drama, so it worked.

I agree that the jokes were extremely on. It was almost like a different show going from last season to this one. I think the only joke of Monica's that I liked over the entire two episodes was when she was showing Chandler that she wanted lilies.

"It's like ONE MIND!"

Not only was it funny, it added more fuel to the Mondler fire.

I took it that they were maybe making a joke out if it, knowing that the people who thought so would use it as proof. It's been a couple of days but I don't remeber specifically any of Monica's jokes, so I can't comment on that right now.

====== es*o*ter*ic b : of or relating to knowledge that is restricted to a small group

2 a : limited to a small circle

I think we were *supposed* to side with Rachel... Monica was being thoughtless when she made her "especially not you" comment, but is in keeping with her annoying S6 personality (why can't they bring back the S1 Monica?), which in turn "justifies" Rachel's reaction.

I think one of the main "good things" Rachel got from Ross out of the relationship was that they were good friends beforehand, and Ross was (almost) always very good to her. However, since they are still good friends, Rachel probably didn't consider this particular aspect as part of their romantic relationship, because Ross has, for the most part, continued to be very good to her..

"Dr. Briefs" wrote:

Gotta disagree. Rachel is Monica's closest, dearest friend both currrently, and from high-school. They have been living together for nearly 6 years. Of all the people in the world, Rachel should have known what this night meant to Monica. Also, Monica enumerates other instances where Rachel has stolen the show, so Monica is not suprised that Rachel again tries to upstage Monica's big announcement.

I think that is where the "especially not you" comment came from.

No, it could be Rachel not wanting to get sentimental with Ross (thereby giving him a false hope of a reunion), when all she wanted was a fling.

That was a totally disappointing storyline. Firstly, it portrays Rachel as (yet again) totally uncaring and selfish, as usual. I thought Rachel was more like the "old" Rachel, but this was an instance of the side of her that turns her into the "Princess-Bitch" so eloquently named by Claire. And secondly, the conversation moved artificially quickly to the "sex" part of it. . . .

And Ross should have seen right through it. How many times does the guy have to mortgage his self-respect for something that never happens. It's getting old. I personally would have a difficult time with a "bonus" night with a girl that he still has a yearning for. It would be setting himself up for heartache, and he should be wise enough to know that. . .

Also, apparently, when Rachel was explaining to Monica as to why she and Ross were kissing, NOBODY mentioned the fact that Ross and Rachel WERE married, and that Rachel is sad because, well, she put herself in that position. She claims to be upset that she isn't even close to being married, (yet Monica is), then she turns around and slams Monica for her choice in fiances (Some thing along the lines that "Well, when YOU were sad you slept with CHANDLER!").

Rachel's gotta lay in the bed she's made for herself. . . .

In article ,

That was so whack!!