802 Review

Oct 4, 2001, 11:15 PM ET12 posts by 7 posters
12 posts
abrahammy

Containing the requisite SPOILER SPACE

SPOILER SPACE

SPOILER SPACE

An uneven episode, where some very large logical holes are offset by many very funny lines and a few very sweet moments. On the whole, I liked this episode more than any Friends episode I've seen in some time, though it still does not compare to the early days.

If this episode has one major flaw, it derives from a fundamentally contrived structure. The events had to play out the way they did so that Rachel and Ross would be physically removed from each other for the entire episode, and to draw out the suspense of the father's identity for as long as possible. To achieve this end, we had several characters doing strange things that were actually kind of out of character. (And two who were, wonderfully, beautifully in character, but more on that later.)

Monica's behavior as a wife is both contrary to what we might expect and very unflattering to her. Even though I am not a particular C&M aficianado, and no fan of CCA at all, I really prefer to buy into the idea that Chandler and Monica have married each other because they want to be together. Certainly that appeared to be the case the day they nearly raced each other into a Vegas chapel two years ago; Monica's attention was on being with Chandler, not on Being a Bride. Here we are led to believe that once the spotlight is off Monica there lingers no residual excitement or joy over the fact that she will spend her life with him, or even residual satisfaction that she proved Judy wrong. As one who has been a bride, this left a pretty sour taste in my mouth. I think it was out of character; at the very least, Monica should be the type of person who spends the entire next episode after her wedding walking up to every single person she sees and shouting "Hi! I'm glad to meet you! I'm *Mrs.* *Bing*! Yes, that's right, *Mrs.* *Chandler* *Bing*!" until everybody wants to Bing her over the head.

I also didn't think the way she opened the packages was in character. Monica is very organized, very orderly, and very correct. Monica would not tear packages open like a crazed toddler; she'd have worked out a meticulous system. The packages would be opened in alphabetical order, with her noting down exactly what was in each package and whom it was from, and then the gifts would be sorted by which cabinet or cupboard she intended to put them in - including a pile for Returns. (This one is handled by Rachel.) The gift which either came without a card, or from which the card was lost, would cause a major upheaval. Her reason for excluding Chandler? Not that she's too big a baby to wait, but because he'd want to open them up his way...like a crazed toddler... and mess up her system, and somebody might not get a thankyou note, and news of the missed thankyou note might get back to Judy, and ooooooh lordy, can't have that...

Chandler and Ross' story was both contrived and unoriginal. The scene where Ross is seen taking all the soap and stuff came right out of a Happy Days episode, and really, the idea that he stayed until the very last moment doesn't really make any sense. I think something must have gotten cut. There is also a very, very bad mistake made at the end. Monica's pouting because she's not a bride anymore, and she sees a freshly taken picture where Chandler is KISSING ANOTHER WOMAN ON HIS WEDDING DAY and this doesn't cause a problem? In a series where Ross saying the wrong name caused a huge crisis for which he was **brutally** punished the entire season by a writing staff who was (and I quote Michael Curtis) "happy Ross got his comuppance?" Here also is another logical hole: Last year, when Monica got engaged, she threw a 21 gun hissy fit because Rachel "stole her thunder" by merely kissing Ross. Here Rachel has REALLY stolen her thunder on her wedding day, and there's not a word about it. Actually, Monica's behavior is much more reasonable here, and the compassion she shows is the appropriate response - but it shows once again that these writers really just don't care in the slightest about consistency of characterization.

That's it for the bad stuff. There are certainly reasons why I did really like much of this episode. Phoebe was at her best - her absolutely, Wacky Wise Woman best. This is the Phoebe that works much better than any other, and she was just priceless. Most of her advice was quite sound, the way she expressed it was funny, and it just worked very well, right down to the point where her very reasonable educated guess about Tag blew up in her embarrassed face. She feels bad, but we don't think badly of her for making a logical mistake.

My favorite scene? Joey's proposal to Phoebe, and the joy of her acceptance, was surprisingly touching; I wish I'd been as moved by C&M's proposal. Obviously, the sweetness of that lovely scene is undercut by the fact that he made the same speech to Rachel, but I forgive that because the second proposal was VERY funny and it really worked. So did Phoebe's reaction. I do, for better or worse, suspect that the writers were indeed trying the idea of an eventual Phoebe/Joey hookup on for size to see if it would work or overload the show with couples.

David Schwimmer is a good director. I think the staging and the pace went very well, and the timing of the scenes clipped in such a way that one might almost not realize that the identity of the father was screaming at us two thirds of the way through the show. (When the audience realizes that Ross is the only person who doesn't know, who else could the father possibly be?) And I leave by pointing out the last logical hole in the show; Rachel at one point discusses the possibility of not telling the father, and furthermore behaves as if she does not know whether or not he would be willing to be involved in the babies' life. Um, how exactly can she avoid either? Ross sees her all the time, he has been in and out of love with her for years, and his devotion to his first child is documented. How exactly was she going to keep Ross from learning about his child, and what on earth made her think this development wasn't going to make him try to be more involved in her life?

But yet, it was a good episode. Good cast. Lots of good laugh lines. Good writing *in places*. Good director. This is at least OK.

Mouseabrahammy

"abrahammy" wrote in message news:%A9v7.2835$[email]...

<snip>

aficianado,

Chandler

other

the

pretty

the

I, too, thought that she would be more excited. Perhaps she just crashed from all the previous excitement? Perhaps it doesn't seem so special just to return to the appartment she has lived in for 8+ years with the husband she has lived with 2+ years? It might seem like a return to ordinary after so many extra special days? Perhaps being a bride wasn't all she had built it up to be (sometimes when one's expectations are too high, reality can never match up)? Maybe the writer's have never been brides?

not

meticulous

noting

them

that

back

But, a the end of season 5 (the one where they go to Vegas), we saw Chandler very carefully opening the present he gave him. Monica quickly got frustrated, ripped the package out of his hand and tore it open. He may have been the very neat one, while her tearing into presents may just be in character. Perhaps opening presents is one of the few times that she lets her hair down?

where

And wasn't Phoebe the one who got all excited in London when she found the maid's cart and she could steal all those little soaps? Ross didn't seem terribly excited about joining her (granted, his wife of a few hours had just left him)

writing

Er...I think what Ross did is a little worse (IMO, course). It betrayed that he was thinking about an ex-girlfriend when he should only have been thinking about the woman he was currently making his bride. It gave the impression that he would rather be marrying the ex-girlfriend...an ex-girlfriend about whom the bride was already jealous and suspicious.

There seemed to be little indication that Chandler and this other woman (who had obviously just got married herself) were an item. Monica knows him well enough to know that this was just another one of Chandler's hair-brained schemes to avoid a confrontation and she is not insecure about his love for her. Besides, she did get mad, he just found a bargaining chip. Finally, another instantly failed wedding on the show would be a little trite (just one more thing, it was the day after his wedding).

she

response -

Maybe she grew up? Also, this (becoming a single mom) has the potential to be way more serious and way more scary for her (and probably requires more support from friends). In addition, this does not involve Ross which I think was part of the problem last year (okay, it does involve Ross, but Monica didn't know that at first).

other,

she

making

I agree, I loved Phoebe in this episode.

I actually enjoyed the OMG, father realization scene better. I especially, liked the delayed reaction of Joey....very reminiscient of his reaction when he figured out about Monica and Chandler (and this time Chandler is the last to know)

might

be?)

one

Ross

her

I think that she might have been in denial. You know, like a kid that thinks that their parents aren't going to notice the big hole in the wall which was created during the wild party they threw while their parents were out of town. She was not thinking rationally.

Good

Yep, I really enjoyed that episode.

Thanks for the insightful review!!

Mouse

TFMMouse
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Oh my gosh, I totally agree with you two, those were two of my abosolute favorite parts, and I've always thought Joey and Phoebe hooking up would be 'predictable' - but at that moment, even though I knew it wasn't real - I wanted them to!!! Maybe it's because Joey was sooooooo sweet :) ~Teresa~

Lewis NguyenMouse

Mouse wrote in message news:4wav7.55873$[email]...

Well, actually, Ross may again be the last to know.

Good episode. I preferred last week. Monica's bad mood went unexplained and the Chandler/Ross storyline wasn't as funny as it could've been. But Pheobe, Joey and Rachel were great--and this was probably Tag at his very best.

Lewis.

MouseLewis Nguyen

"Lewis Nguyen" wrote in message news:o3bv7.40710$[email]...

especially,

he

Oh, I was just refering to the "secret" relationship between Ross and Rachel...as in two of the Friends have been dating (or something) on the sly. I figure Ross knows about that ;-)

But, you are probably right, Ross will likely be the last to know that he is going to be a father again.

and

Pheobe,

Great summary.

Yes, Tag was better than normal, but I'm glad that this story line won't be bringing him back. I just don't like that character.

Mouse

ToddMouse

"abrahammy" wrote...

"Mouse" wrote:

The episodes afterwards did establish that Ross was still in love with Rachel (the idiot). But that episode only suggested that he was very happy to have one of his closest friends make it to his wedding when he didn't think she would be there.

Todd the respond to e-mail address belongs to a spammer [email] (really at inreach)
MouseTodd

"Todd" wrote in message news:[email]...

pouting

doesn't

that

thinking

about

True. I think that at the time, Ross was convinced that he was only happy to see his good friend at the wedding - subliminally, there was probably a lot more going on. Also, from Emily's point of view, Ross saying the name of his ex-girlfriend, with whom he is still a VERY good friend, was pretty serious. One can kind of understand why she might be more upset than Monica was when she found out that Chandler had kissed some stranger to cover the fact he had lost the table cameras.

BTW when you said "(the idiot)", were you refering to Ross for still being in love with Rachel or Rachel for acting like one? Or what?

Mouse

ToddMouse

"Todd" (that's me) wrote:

"Mouse" wrote:

I was calling Ross an idiot for still being in love with Rachel after her "He's with someone else; I want him!"/"He's free; I don't want him," behavior.

When the series started I wanted to see Ross and Rachel together, but after the yo-yoing, I decided that they didn't belong together. Especially since they put Monica and Chandler together.

Course, now that Rachel

SPOILER

SPOILER

SPOILER

is pregnant with Ross' child, I know they'll get together. They'll have to rename the series to Relatives because four of the six will be related.

Todd the respond to e-mail address belongs to a spammer [email] (really at inreach)
abrahammyTodd

"Todd" wrote in message news:[email]...

Oh, don't worry, it gets even better. We will soon find out that Frank Buffay was Charles Bing's long-lost second cousin. Then Ross and Rachel will adopt Joey just so he won't feel left out. :-)

Paul Hyettabrahammy

On Fri, 5 Oct 2001, abrahammy stated this considered view. Waking from my doze, I hastily scrawled -

No - really? :)

You'd hope so!

She probably already made an announcement in the NY Times. :)

One time she was ill, she left used tissues all over the place too.

I can *so* see that! :)

I think it would only matter if Monica found out before the ceremony.

What intrigues me is why Joey thinks be might be responsible if Phoebe was pregnant! :)

Side-stepping that land-mine... :)

When & how it happened is what I look forward to finding out!

IMO never out!

I just hope Emily doesn't show up one day with Ross's child in tow, too!

Paul 'US Sitcom Fan' Hyett - The Wild Frame Grabber of the Net! Website at http://www.activist.demon.co.uk/USsitcoms/
p r i y aPaul Hyett

I had already read the spoiler and didn't expect much from this one but it had its moments. I laughed out loud many times but its clearly no competition to episodes from earlier seasons.

I didnt care much for CCA until Chandler and Monica were made an item. I thought she was okay, till I saw scream 2&3 (the part was okay).

The weakest storyline was Monica opening all the presents and being so shrieky. My memory isn't that good so help me out here. Did we see a little bit of screechy Monica in this episode?? God, I hope not. I SO wanted to grab that gift joey's parents gave (salomi buddy?? whats that??) and whack her with it.

Doubt it very much. She's isn't too pleased about taking his last name.

I can't believe I'm saying this. But I would have preferred this than what she actually did. In this case, even if Chandler were around, he would have gladly let her open all the presents instead of going through the torture of opening them meticulously.

Monica was upset in 701 cos she knew that Rach kissed Ross just so she'd have something that night. In 801, Rachel is dealing with an unplanned pregnancy. Monica would never be that insensitive and put her best friend down at a time like that. Glad the writers didnt make Monica throw 'you stole my thunder' fit.

I fell off my chair laughing. "Ofcourse I'll marry you"

He didn't think he was responsible. Phoebe had told him that a Davin Lynn was the father. So when he found him or dint find him, Joey was being a great friend and offered to be there for her. Good old Joey, bless his heart.

OMG, I cried a river at that scene. I still need tissues to watch that scene.

He does a good job directing. He's done some good work in the past too with TOO the last night and ....I can't remember anymore. :)

She would have told him sometime or the other. Phoebe just scared a bit that Rachel was getting nervous about telling the father, thats all.

Ewww. No way.

The Chandler - Ross was very funny. I liked the Ross's fake speech. But the Chandler stole the show by kissing that other bride. OMG That was sooo funny.

I wonder how many people almost had a coronary when they saw Tag in CP waiting for Rachel.

All in all, the episode was alright. I'll give it a C+

-Priya

p r i y aPaul Hyett

Reposting this message as the earlier message is full of mistakes.

I had already read the spoiler and didn't expect much from this one but it had its moments. I laughed out loud many times but its clearly no competition to episodes from earlier seasons.

I didnt care much for CCA until Chandler and Monica were made an item. I thought she was okay, till I saw scream 2&3 (the 1st part was okay).

The weakest storyline was Monica opening all the presents and being so shrieky. My memory isn't that good so help me out here. Did we see a little bit of screechy Monica in this episode?? God, I hope not. I SO wanted to grab that gift joey's parents gave (salomi buddy?? whats that??) and whack her with it.

Doubt it very much. She's isn't too pleased about taking his last name.

I can't believe I'm saying this. But I would have preferred this than what she actually did. In this case, even if Chandler were around, he would have gladly let her open all the presents instead of going through the torture of opening them meticulously.

Monica was upset in 701 cos she knew that Rach kissed Ross just so she'd have something that night. In 801, Rachel is dealing with an unplanned pregnancy. Monica would never be that insensitive and put her best friend down at a time like that. Glad the writers didnt make Monica throw 'you stole my thunder' fit.

I fell off my chair laughing. "Ofcourse I'll marry you"

He didn't think he was responsible. Phoebe had told him that a David Lynn was the father. So when he found him or dint find him, Joey was being a great friend and offered to be there for her. Good old Joey, bless his heart.

OMG, I cried a river at that scene. I still need tissues to watch that scene. Okay thats not really true but I get pretty choked up. :)

He does a good job directing. He's done some good work in the past too with TOO the last night and ....I can't remember anymore. :)

She would have told him sometime or the other. Phoebe just scared her a bit and got her really nervous about telling the father. Thats all.

Ewww. No way.

The Chandler-Ross story was very funny. I liked the Ross's fake speech. But the Chandler stole the show by kissing that other bride. OMG That was sooo funny.

I wonder how many people almost had a coronary when they saw Tag in CP waiting for Rachel. :) My husband was so bummed when he saw Tag.

All in all, the episode was alright. I'll give it a C+

-Priya