It's been established that there are drug dealers at Lawndale High.
2) We've seen Andrea drink. And lots of people were drinking at the party in "Invitation".
Trent smokes.
Having said that, I agree that any drug use is downplayed, for two big reasons:
Daria's the VP character, and she doesn't use drugs, drink, or smoke, and
2) This is American TV, and we're damned puritanical about showing that kind of thing.
My great fear is that if Daria ever had an episode hinge on or even seriously mention drug use, either it would degenerate into an After-School Special or it would arouse serious controversy ("everyone knows" that Daria is a show for "teens") and lead to the show's cancellation.
I could easily see this happen given their personalities (and Sandi's manipulative nature, if she controls the supply). But they would NEVER do this plot on the show.
On 05 Sep 1999 15:30:18 GMT, [email] (Jordan S. Bassior) wrote:
That's kinda paranoid? Lot's of people yell and scream about lots of things in America, but when was the last time a show actually got cancelled because of it?
I don't see it. I really don't. They have everything they want. What advantage does drugs have for them?
Kyle, The Manny Alexander of alt.sports.baseball.chicago.cubs
"Kissing is touching your lips to the better end of 66 feet of intestine"
And the cough reappears in a lot of subsequent Trent episodes, too. Then, he has that lighter to hold up concert-goer style at Jane's track meet in "See Jane Run".
So, just because he has a lighter, he's automatically a smoker? I have a lighter as well (got three of 'em, actually) yet I don't smoke. I use 'em to light the barbecue grill.
Not saying he *doesn't* smoke, but we've never seen it. He wouldn't do it around Daria in any case.
</0.02>
Marty Charter Member, Secret Underground Bummer Culture Silver Grove, KY Chapter
I know a bunch of non-smokers with lighters. They're just pyros. They use them for lighting creamer on fire in the youth group room.
Dagny
http://members.aol.com/Eccles9697
"I'm not different for the sake of being different, only for the desperate sake of being myself. I can't join your gang: you'd think I was a phony and I'd know it." Vivian Stanshall
one of my friends is a smoker and a pyro. he melts plastic, and sets light to things, and stuff. but he wouldn't lend me his cigarette the other night so i could burn myself. the hypocrite.
erm.. why would you want to go do a silly thing like burn yourself with a cigarette?Hell, if your into self mutilation try acid and leave the cigs for us smokers..
I had a friend in school who used candle wax... no permanent scars that way... Of course, I knew another girl who used to carve boys names and things into her arms, legs, stomach, etc with a razor blade... She got locked away in an institution... I think she's still there...
Marie
"When I was born I did lament and cry And now each day doth shew the reason why." -Richard Watkyns
on a completely unrelated note, does anyone in the UK here get Meridian? my french class is on the news at 6pm today. the school won an award languages for 16-19-year-olds or something... so they had the 6th form spend their lunch time and half their afternoon lesson sitting in the computer centre thingie, being filmed. fun.
No... that was Jake. Our bathroom hasn't lit on fire yet, luckily. Since I'd be blamed for it. Because they can, and I'm expendable: that is to say, not in any sports.
Dagny
http://members.aol.com/Eccles9697
"I'm not different for the sake of being different, only for the desperate sake of being myself. I can't join your gang: you'd think I was a phony and I'd know it." Vivian Stanshall
I like Porsches. I think the youth group should start building porsches for the underpriveleged. They can start with me, I'm obviously underpriveleged because... uuh...my mother never gave me a credit card at the mall and said "Don't spend more than $500" (like Connie's...) and she makes me eat cheap rotten food from Save -a-Lot
Dagny
http://members.aol.com/Eccles9697
"I'm not different for the sake of being different, only for the desperate sake of being myself. I can't join your gang: you'd think I was a phony and I'd know it." Vivian Stanshall
I think Quinn would be an obvious candidate to take Ecstasy. Also -- to resurrect the sex thing -- to turn out to be a lesbian. After all, she's resisted taking any of her male admirers seriously. I can just imagine her and Sandi hitting it off.... classic butch/fem pair!
This has already been done in fanfic... or at least hinted at. Can't remember the title of the story but I *know* I've seen this somewhere. If anyone knows the one I mean please post the title here.
Stacy, yeah. She craves acceptance so much she might resort to it. Quinn, OTOH, probably wouldn't go for it. Seems to me that she shares at least some of Daria's morals.
Either way, I don't think we'll see it from Glenn & Co.
Marty Charter Member, Secret Underground Bummer Culture Silver Grove, KY Chapter
On Tue, 07 Sep 1999 14:11:48 -0400, William Fowler wrote:
"Friends Are So Alarming," <SHAMELESS-PLUG> online at Outpost Daria. </SHAMELESS-PLUG>
Martin
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This may go back to the earlier speculation of whether or not any Lanes smoke pot - but there are no episodes with clear evidence supporting Trent as a smoker. The only smoking I recall is Mr. Demartino and Heather (this name is coming up quite a bit) who was the tour guide in "College Bored".
On Tue, 07 Sep 1999 00:15:41 GMT, Tice Rust wrote:
I've just rewatched it. It has a smoking monkey in SSW but besides that, no cigarettes.
Dammit, why does everyone take you for a smoker if you have a lighter. Happened to me a couple of times already. I carry a lighter in my pocket all the time because it is very handy sometimes like when the waiter forgot to light the candle at your table and whenever I take it out, people get this look and say "I didn't know you were a smoker." MSB
p.s.: Whenever a smoker asks me "Do you have fire?" I answer "Yeah, but I ain't givin' you any." Being able to do this makes it worth carrying a lighter around.
Just out of curiousity, have you seen any of the shows? There are several episodes that have everything you are asking about. For instance, "ILL" has Jake freaking because he thinks Daria is using drugs, "Road Worrier" has several references to drug use, and "Teachings of Don Jake" has Jake, Helen, and Quinn eating berries containing hallucinogens. Mr. Demartino smokes in "The Big House", and the episodes I can name that show alcohol use are "Cafe Disaffecto" (Andrea), "Pinch Sitter" (Jake), "The Daria Hunter" (Mr D, Jake), and "That Was Then, This is Dumb" (Coyote, Jake) just off the top of my head.
This could be one of those "future plots" ideas - Andrea was drinking in "Cafe Disaffecto", maybe something with her?
Maybe they do - why would it be necessary to show this? It doesn't add to the plot line, not so far anyway, so there is no real reason to throw gratuitous drug use in.
Yeah of course, I watch it the four days of the week that its on here.
I do remember drug references in "Teachings of Don Jake", that incidentally was a really funny episode. Kinda Simpsonesque in it's hallucinogenic meets domestic plot line.
I stand corrected.
No, I would like to see a non 'alternative' character, like Quinn or even Brittany experiment with drugs.
I would like to see a little gratuitous drug use personally, or at least a bong on a coffee table or something.
the thing you've got to remember is that this is a suburban school, and while drug use is present, it is rarely obvious and doesn't occur in public, at least at school, or the pizza parlor, two places Daria is most likely to be (this is about Daria, remember)... I think that "uuh... we're talking about us" guy in "Esteemsters" was a little "out there", so it's pretty much that drug use occurs, but not necessarily in the circle of the main characters.
Also, people trying to be "cool" in a suburban setting like the fashion club rarely use drugs as a means to that end. That would cut into their money for a new spring wardrobe, anyway. And do you see the way those junkies dress? Eww...
Dagny
http://members.aol.com/Eccles9697
"I'm not different for the sake of being different, only for the desperate sake of being myself. I can't join your gang: you'd think I was a phony and I'd know it." Vivian Stanshall
Yes. And Daria's personality is such that it would be very out of character for her to seek drugs out. The only way I can see her getting into a situation where she would encounter them would be 1) if one of her friends was really messing themselves up with drugs, but that's a VERY dark sort of story if done seriously rather than in After-School Special mode, or 2) if Daria had to descend into a Den of Iniquity (skeevy hangout sort of place) for some plot related reason (which could be funny).
Of the main circle of characters, in terms of drug use:
Daria ... no way.
Jane ... she's probably experimented at some point, but she would never do it around Daria.
Trent ... he's almost definitely experimented, and could be smoking pot (it would suit his personality), but again, he would avoid doing this around Daria.
Quinn ... no way. Her morals are rather similar to Daria's in most regards.
Jake and Helen ... we KNOW that they did drugs in their hippie phase, it's been mentioned in more than one episode.
The FC ... they would do anything that seemed "cool", but as Dagny pointed out, in their circle, drugs wouldn't be "cool". I could easily see Stacy getting into drugs, though.
Jodie, Mack ... no way.
Kevin, Brittany ... Probably not, but if they did who would be able to tell the difference?
Andrea ... definitely at risk. We know she drinks, and is probably not a happy person.
Upchuck ... probably not.
Tom ... we don't know enough about him to be sure, but probably not.
Yeah. When they get older they might get into "uppers", up to and including cocaine, for the weight loss and overall perkiness effect. Stacy and Tiffany, especially Stacy, would be the ones at risk here.
How are things different? Are there cameras in the rest rooms now? I certainly went on in my school.
The clubs she and Jane go to to see Trent play in probably have their share of drugs. But unless the users are incredibly stupid, you have to know wht to look for. I can't see where anything we've seen in Daria's life could have really clued her in.
The FC definately would not be the type to do drugs... It's the cash issue, plus have you noticed how druggies look in general? Bloodshot eyes, sniffing, smelling like weed... not the image they're going for... maybe later, in college they might get in to some rec. drugs like coke when they start to realize how empty their lives are. As for Jane and Trent, I agree that they probably experimented a bit, it would have been easy. Why would Daria and Quinn do something that their parents did? That would be like so uncool... Kev and Brittney, and Mack and Jodie probably do drink beer. All the football players (and their girlfriends) did in my school, anyway. UpChuck? Yeah, right, he'd be the one smoking the fake oregano joint and getting so high... Andrea? Wouldn't surprise me...
For the record, Jordan, Coke is not an upper... it's actually a downer which is why you're not supposed to drink if you do it, being as alcohol is a downer too and the two together supposedly pose a risk to your heart... even if you're young and healthy. (Can you tell I had a lot of friends in HS who were druggies?) No recreational drug (I am not talking about Heroin, angeldust, pcp, acid, etc.) that I can think of makes you perky... that's a myth... Mostly what they do is make you not care for awhile but it's fleeting and it all comes back down doubled. Frankly, I never understood the craze for most of the rec. drugs... it was mostly hype and a waste of money... A bottle of vodka was always much more effective and cheaper...
Marie
"I quote others in order to better express my own self." -Montaigne
I think Dagny's point was that Lawndale isn't the sort of school where you could hang out in full view of everyone smoking pot or worse. Among other things, it's run by a paranoid fond of snap inspections.
really
Well, Daria is a very perceptive person. My point is that if she noticed someone using drugs she would tend to avoid them socially (which is wise), and as a result they would have very little impact upon her adventure at the club.
Very good point.
Heh heh heh ... yes, plus it can help you stay thin. (At the cost of wrecking your health, particularly cardiac).
Heck, their parents probably left drugs lying around the house at one point.
Heh ... didn't think of that angle but yes :)
Absolutely. Kevin and Brittany would get wasted, Mack and Jodie would consume more moderately.
ROFL! This I could see ...
We know she drinks, and probably hard liquor because she bothered to brown-bag it.
I did not know that. Then why does it elevate heart rate?
Horrendously so. Cocaine is a scary drug, for one so commonly used. If you have any kind of cardiac weakness, it can kill you within a matter of minutes; even without it, a large dose or synergism with other drugs can induce a fatal heart attack. Prolonged use is very likely to weaken one's heart and increase the likelihood of a later heart attack.
It's true that there are some native Andean cultures which chew coca, but the dosage they ingest in this manner is much lower than you would get from sniffing powdered cocaine, and they live in an environment where the air is so rarefied that an elevation of metabolic rate is necessary to do anything extremely strenuous (like be a foot courier, the traditional Inca use for the drug).
Here speaks a woman who requires ludicrous amounts of alcohol to actually get drunk. (Coming from a man who gets tipsy on a couple of wine coolers) :)
Well there's a large range of difference in terms of things like drugs at school. At Kelloggsville, a sorta lower-middle-class school in this area, it would be very present, as would many other things. But Lawndale is more like Grandville. There is no drug use OBVIOUS in the school. Besides maybe underage drinking-- Kevin's beer can thing from one of the books implies drinking beer, etc, and Andrea was seen drinking. But besides drinking and cigarettes, DRUG USE IS NOT OBVIOUSLY SEEN. If one is using drugs it is as far seperated from the school as possible, because 1.) druggies are not the majority and would stick out 2.) security from the fascist principal
so does Alley. I just thought I'd mention that.
Dagny
http://members.aol.com/Eccles9697
"I'm not different for the sake of being different, only for the desperate sake of being myself. I can't join your gang: you'd think I was a phony and I'd know it." Vivian Stanshall
Better check the record again. Cocaine is a stimulant, working by inhibiting re-uptake of the neurotransmitter norepinephrine. It has much the same effect as amphetamines. After a while you crash, sometimes developing depression in the process. In that sense it certainly is a downer.
I've never tried it myself. I've never even known anyone who used it. If you read the material on the drug it ought to be enough to scare the hell out of you.
There is often a great difference between how drugs are supposed to work and how they actually do... If technically coke is a stimulant... it certainly isn't in practice... Most users consider it a downer, it also acts just like a downer... Drugs that are labeled (loosely) as _downers_ do not make the user especially depressed or even necessarily tired (right away, anyway)... Even ludes and valium don't necessarily do that. What they usually do in practice is relax you... sometimes, extremely so... One of the more popular "cocktails" that some of my friends did when I was in HS was to mix coke and crank (not crack! crank is an extreme, extreme upper that can keep you awake for days). The biggest reason for doing this was because it would have you "up" one minute then "down" the next... of course, the fact that it was very dangerous and sometimes caused heart attacks and such in kids was, I think, part of the attraction... IMO, people that do drugs either have a death wish or honestly don't care whether they die or not... I knew alot of people who did drugs often and most of them knew all about what the drugs could do to them (we all had drug education in 5th grade) but it never mattered really... Teenagers had a tendancy to be fearless and to believe nothing bad could ever happen to them... With today's culture, I don't know if this is true anymore... Drugs are a lot more dangerous nowadays then they used to be... if the drugs themselves don't hurt you then the pesticides and other things they spray on them will... not to mention some of the downright posionous chemicals they cut them with now...
Marie
"I quote others in order to better express my own self." -Montaigne
Whew boy! As a survivor of the Chemical Wars, I gotta wade in here.
As explained before, coke is a stimulant and works as one. The downer part comes along as the effects wear off. If you've got cokehead friends that think of coke as a downer, I would suggest that you tell them to find a more reputable dealer.
Hmmm... Meth-amphetimene(sp?) aka crank in my neck of the woods is also known as 'Poor Mans Coke'. I don't think your friends knew what they were trying to do.
Mixing uppers and downers is like playing russian roulette with a .45 automatic. The human body can take a lot of abuse and can be pushed either up or down, within reason, but the body tends to become confused when told to go both ways at the same time and will shut itself down until the brain makes up it's mind. The trouble comes when the brain dies due to lack of blood flow before telling the body which way to go.
I don't think it's changed at all. Teenagers today act pretty much as I did back in my misspent youth, around the time of the taming of fire.
Whoo boy, I'm sorry, but I can't agree with you here. I would agree that *part* of the nature of the danger has shifted. When was the last time anyone heard of some kid pulling a Janis by downing a fistful of Mother's Little Helpers and washing them down with a fifth of dad's booze? I haven't heard or read about some kid jumping off a building thinking he could fly simply because the acid suppliers have cut the dosage down to 10 to 20 percent of what it once was (on this one, YMMV).
The only shift that I can see is that the chemists have gotten fancier in that there are far more types of designer drugs around now than before. The basic danger of putting an unknown substance of unknown origin and unknown quality into your body remains the same.
That's sort of weird. Where i'm from, meth is known as ..well meth, you are refering to crystal meth, right? Crank was something a bit different then meth, a snortable powder which wasn't half as good as coke, and yup, crank was known as the "poor mans coke".
Meth was a huge problem where I lived. (Hawaii). I believe 5 years ago (give or take a year) we were voted one of the top 3 places where there was a big meth problem. Other 2 areas I believe were San Diego and some place in Texas. Of course they blamed it all on the Koreans, but that's a whole nother story. :)
Where I grew up, there was a lot of drugs... Our town bordered Camden, one of the worse (if not the worst) cities in South Jersey... (North Jersey is a whole nother country...) But oddly enough, we didn't have a real big problem with serious drug use... It was just a boring town I think... The adults (ie parents, school, police) were all worried about pot and alcohol and would have these big marijuana busts, which was funny, considering the other _real_ drugs kids used more often... Camden, on the other hand, had a huge heroin problem...
Marie
"If you do not live what you believe, you will believe what you live." -Kanti Gala
I haven't seen any major shift in drug use over the years, at least not since crack took off back in the '80s. We don't see as much Quaalude use since it was pulled off the commercial market. But heroin is still there. Coke is still there. (And, believe me, physiologocally it *is* a stimulant. I've seen it cause MIs in twenty-five year olds.) Speed is there. Downers are there. Kids still huff paint. Acid is still there. Out here in the Lawndale-like 'burbs, it's not a major, every day thing, but it's there. You'd think these kids would take a look at their parents and decide to do better. Guess not.
Sorry, I can only go on my own experiences... A number of my friends were dealers so I do know something about the quality and cutting... But I did grow up in Jersey so who knows if the chemicals used here are normal for other places... Maybe we just had a different idea of uppers and downers then normal... most people I know who did coke did it for recreational use, to relax... When they wanted an upper, they did speed...
No, not meth... that is different... Crank was a powder... it was like Diet pills to the 100th power... You could not eat on it... you could not sleep on it... you felt like a robot (completely without emotions) if you did too much... It was never known in my area as "Poor Man's Coke." Hell, it cost almost as much as coke... Maybe it's a regional thing...
I agree... fortunately none of my friends ever had any real problems with it... though they generally shot it up, which I always thought was a questionable thing and much more dangerous then simply snorting it... The sensations were supposed to be much more enhanced... I will point out that I avoided people who did drugs... by this, I mean heroin, angeldust, crack, etc... So my experience with drugs is limited...
Unfortunately, this is probably true... I was a teenager back in the mid-late 80's and most of the drug users I knew then have moved on to more healthy lifestyles... I guess I just keep hoping that the next generation will learn from the past ones...
It still happens... it's just not as news worthy anymore... a sign of the times...
My point was that reletively harmless drugs, like pot, are more dangerous (and sometimes lethal) now because of the chemicals that are sprayed on them in the fields... illegal pesticides are used alot on these crops and some governments spray the fields with toxins to try to contol the drug traffic, but the growers sell it anyway... As for designer drugs... I don't even know how anyone can keep up with them all, anymore...
We do this every day as it is, simply by eating food... But I agree with your original meaning.
Marie
"If you do not live what you believe, you will believe what you live." -Kanti Gala
I will point out that I avoided people who did _serious_ drugs... by this, I mean heroin, angeldust, crack, etc... So my experience with drugs is limited...
On Sun, 05 Sep 1999 20:20:08 GMT, [email] (Tarvok) wrote:
If Amanda Lane was any more relaxed, she'd be in a coma. :-)
Martin
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I think that the sister with the parrot (sorry, forgot her name, too lazy to look it up, blah blah) could use to be a little more relaxed "Hey, man, forget about the volcano, here, smoke some weed"
"hey, what volcano?"
Dagny
http://members.aol.com/Eccles9697
"I'm not different for the sake of being different, only for the desperate sake of being myself. I can't join your gang: you'd think I was a phony and I'd know it." Vivian Stanshall
On 05 Sep 1999 21:08:10 GMT, [email] (Dagny Scott) wrote:
I'll buy that. If anyone needs relaxing, it's Penny. Anyone who's so tightly wound that they don't even notice they're pouring themselves a glass of silver nitrate *needs* some mind-altering chemicals. :-)
Martin
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Upchuck s a prime candidate for smart drugs. I bet he grows up to be a part time chemist, spending extraordinary amounts of hours in his laboratory trying to create the drug to enable him to take over the world.
Just on a tangent, could you imagine the offspring of Daria and Upchuck..?