Spoiler Space... * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * my 'shipper membership to the Jane/Tom Club! Also, it's been a week now; has anyone written any fanfiction incorporating the Jane/Tom relationship?
On another note, Now that Daria is "free", how many of you think she should look up Ted DeWitt-Clinton? (Daria on the rebound? Ted might get lucky...) Interesting plot, anyway. The point is, now that Jane has broken the logjam and is dating, Daria feels like a fifth wheel, and may be more prone to REALLY seek out a relationship herself...
Bob Ohler wrote in message news:7pvob7$1ci$[email]...
Yeah! What's wrong with Lerman? That line of his when he asked the groom what he did, "What did you say you do? I thought I heard 'intelligence' but that can't be right." was absolutely PERFECT. And he backed Daria up when she said she was an exotic dancer. You sense her appreciation from her expression. And when they parted, he said, "It's been fun." and Daria admitted, "Yeah." Lerman is great!
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my 'shipper membership
For Daria to date, the fellow would have to pass through the gauntlet
that downed Trent-- Daria's judgement. Jane has failed it on several
occasions, but Daria needs her and manages to bend her standards for Jane. For
the same reason, Tom has provisional acceptance. You DID notice that Tom is
PERFECT didn't you -- had to be-- any slightest imperfection and Daria
wouldn't even provisionally accept him-- then Jane would have to dump Tom
because he would think Daria is a jerk (for some reason).
Key point-- I don't think this story is over, I think its the first of
a two-parter (though not literally). Daria has dismissed Trent for being
(artisticly) identical to herself and possesing a personal imperfection (Note
that Trent is still the best guy Daria knows in Lawndale except possibly for
Mac and, of course, Tom. By Lawndale standards, Trent is a "catch" and Tom
is a God). Daria cannot possibly get with anybody unless she is willing to
allow another person to fail to live up to her standards. What episode was it
where Helen noted that Daria holds standards that even she herself cannot live
up to?
Were this Classical Greek theatre, I would say somebody's hubris is
setting them up for a fall and the gods are moving.
We don't know that Trent is down for the count yet.
Daria's acceptance of Jane's imperfections is part of her growing maturity. The real growth will come when Daria can realize, and accept, her OWN imperfections. Which I think is starting to happen ... Daria admitted she had made a mistake about Tom.
He seemed like a nice, intelligent guy, but I wouldn't call him "perfect" ... just "not noticably flawed". Whatever imperffections he may have are yet to be revealed.
You're assuming that Daria would never yield, and that Jane would go along with her no matter what it's effect on her own happiness would be. Neither Daria nor Jane are robots.
What? How is Trent artistically identical to Daria?
"Unreliability" is a very major flaw in a person if you're thinking about getting seriously involved with them.
I think she is learning to tolerate imperfection. I also think that her high standards are not an unreservedly bad thing. Imagine how she might be, and suffer, if she has LOW standards.
"Monster". And it's MAJOR foreshadowing, IMO ...
Yes. I think that the day will come when Daria screws up in a MAJOR way and will have to live with not only the consequences of her mistake, but with her merciless self-condemnation.
Sincerely Yours, Jordan
"All the Universe or Nothingness ... that is the question. Which shall it be?" (H. G. Wells)
Jordan S. Bassior wrote in message news:[email]...
Yeah we do. Admit it to yourself. Trent's done, stick a fork in him.
Jane.
maturity. The
she had
"perfect" ...
yet to be
Tom
along with
Daria nor
about
Only if it's important to YOU. My brother-in-law is chronically unpunctual. One time he accidently showed up on time for a date and my sister wasn't ready. He asked why. She told him, "You're always late, I figured I had another two hours." She married him anyway. There are other character flaws she'd consider much more serious, apparently she was willing to compromise on tardiness.
her high
and
Daria wouldn't be Daria without standards. Quinn wouldn't be Quinn without standards. It's just that Daria's standards involve honesty and intelligence and Quinn's involve what kind of car the guy drives.
cannot
Foreshadowing for that episode, maybe, major foreshadowing for the series, for current events, I don't think so.
way and
with her
What's unique about that? Been there, done that, got the T-shirt, wore it out and used it to wax the car. The thing about those of us like Daria is that we hold ourselves to impossible standards and beat ourselves up for not meeting them. Sometimes you finally just give up on standards and say to hell with it.
Which is why I'm not ready to stick a fork in Trent-- although if Daria DOESN'T go through some major defining change, then Trent has sailed.
I repeat, who in Lawndale (besides Tom and Mac) is BETTER than Trent?
The question then becomes what do the writers do to replace the Sam and Diane sexual tension (the bane of every S-T sitcom). Dropping the crush is like having Quinn decide her values are too shallow and studying religious philosophy-- it disables a major premise joke.
I think that this is one reason why the writers decided to make *Daria* about a LOT more than just that crush.
I actually do think that Quinn will mature someday, and has shown some signs of trending towards greater maturity. Though not of studying religious philosophy ;-)
It occurs to me that Quinn could probably be brought into advanced mathematics and computer science if one could suggest constructing a properly weighted set of equations to determine the exact degree of popularity.
Organic chemistry-- to achieve a REAL predictable relationship between the appearence of cosmetics and skin type.
He has no revealed imperfections = he is perfect-- until further developed. If added to the cast, Tom is a major violation of Lawndale reality-- the only truly non-comicly-screwed-up person in the city. In a world where Tom can exist, who could tolerate Ms. Lee, or Jake, or, or, ANY of them! (including Daria) with the possible exception of Jane and the wierd exception of Jodie and Mac (apparently being black counts as being comicly-screwed up-- weird wierd wierd). ..
Trent's artistic failure in this season closer was identical to Daria's artistic failure in last season's closer-- nothing he wrote was good enough.
I don't think that Lawndale is all that "comically screwed-up". The characters are just slight exaggerations of real personality types. I've known a LOT of people like the ones on the show.
Daria's not all that screwed up. What she mostly is is very intelligent, principled, and honest.
Jane's more relaxed than Daria, but she's anything but "normal".
Jodie's problem is that her family expects her to be "perfect". Mack's problem is that he totally fails to fit the black male stereotype. They're both pretty good kids.
Jodie has a wicked sense of humor that she sometimes reveals, especially to Mack and Daria. Mack is if anything the CLASSIC concept of an athletic hero (before "jock" became an insult) ... strong, smart, and decent.
I tend to see Daria as pretty severely screwed up-- she seems to show a really severe self-loathing on frequent occasions.
And if I may be permitted, I would like to offer a quote from Patrick O'Brian's "The Thirteen Gun Salute" (Stephan Maturin speaking to discourage an unwanted confidence -- speaking to unintendedly harsh effect)
"Yet it is curious to see how the self-hater often succeeds in retaining his self-esteem in relation to others, usually by means of a general denigration: he sees himself as a worthless creature, but his fellows as more worthless still."
Oh, come on, everybody (with the possible exception of Johnny Bravo) hates themself at sometime, at least a little. Of course... That doesn't neccessarily mean that they admit it, even to themselves.
And your quote is very true, I know at last one person now who acts thusly. However, Daria is willing to give credit where it is due. There are people, not many, but some, whom she looks up to. Daria doesn't hate herself, or anyone else, so much as suffer from normal teenage doubts, anxieties, and pessimism.
Marie
(standing at the blackboard) I will use spoiler space in the future. I will use spoiler space in the future. I will use spoiler space in the future. I will use spoiler space in the future. Whew, does anyone have one of those 5-pronged chalk thingys?