My thoughts on "Writer where it Hurts"

You know something, I could have said alot of hurtful remarks about this episode, but I'm not, for the simple fact that it suprised me. Much like Daria's story assignment, this episode got better as it progressed.

It started out as another typical half assed episode. Daria's sitting there reading, cracking jokes, Jake making a fool out of himself. And you guys are going to be all over me for this one, but Daria was out of character once again, at least for the first two acts. This time she was angry, and hostile. You could really tell that this story was getting to her. She couldn't write a good story, and it was eating her away. That plus she was complaining about not going to parties, well it just wasn't like her to say that.

But then the show took a turn for the better. It became a subtle mother-daughter moment. It wasn't the standard, Helen shows concern, than gets a phone call and ignores Daria. Helen realized what she was doing and decided to be there for her daughter. Daria then writes an honest and plausible future, that was touching. But the absolute best part is right after Helen read the story, Daria reverted back to her standard cynic mode. I most certainly wouldn't say she is exactly the same as she always was. She's wiser, she's grown from this experience, and all once again within in the confines of her sarcastic, bad ass shell. This is the type of characterization I want to see. Not bellybutton rings, not her dressing up like Quinn, not her having nightmares about being Quinn, or getting pissed when Quinn gets popularity from writing a poem. Not going ga-ga over Trent, or getting a rash over him. They finally hit the nose, it hasn't been on target like this in a long time. Overall, wonderful end to the second season, and if it's any indication of the third season, I'm in for the long haul. Grade A

Pet Peeves

The clock hands are back, yeah!!! Couldn't Daria have included Andrea in one of her stories??? Was it too much to ask?? So Jamie is Quinns future husband?? I wouldn't be suprised if those kids are by different men. Which did you find better, the Jake knight and Helen witch, or the Jake witch and the Helen knight. I like the Jake witch the best The future Daria looked pretty cute to me.

So, what did you all think???

In the future scene, what did Helen say Daria's husbands name was? The name sounded strange. It started with "m". It sounded Italian. She did not say "Trent." Of this I am sure. Sort of.

In article , [email] (RecurveTD2) wrote:

Yeah...it was Marcello or something like that.

I don't think she's in any way shape or form thinking marriage with anyone. I think the exotic nature of the guy who's mentioned in an offhand way (Italian-born university Professor) is a sign that she really doesn't take the idea of being with one person for the rest of her life seriously.

And certainly...whatever happens in her life, she DOESN'T want to breed.

However, Trent *did* show up in the Jane Austen parody. Trent wears the 19th Century garb well, although Jesse does not.

--.\\<-H--

Michelle Klein-Hass ([email]) wrote:

I was immensely distracted by the description of Jesse as "his [Trent's] sister's admirer". Was this meant to imply that Jesse has a crush on Jane in the show proper? The mind boggles.

-Monty

In article , [email] (Monty Ashley) wrote:

Really? I didn't find it that surprising. You really think it's mind boggling that some guy in a band would have the hots for the sexy little sister of a bandmate?

• TDH

The mind boggles. <<

Of course. Recall the return trip in "Road Worrier"? Trent's driving, Daria's in the passenger seat, and Jane is snoozing on Jesse's shoulder in the back. No surprise here. I'd characterize it as just as serious, and easily as exploitable (from a writer's perspective) as the Daria/Trent "relationship."

Peace Kevin

The Crusher ([email]) wrote:

No, I found it surprising that if Jesse *is* supposed to have a crush on Jane, there'd been no noticeable hints in that direction. Indeed, people have theorized that Jane might have a crush on Jesse (based, I think, on the scene at the swap meet where Jane and Jesse go off for eats), but nobody had brought up that it might be the other way around.

-Monty

On 5 Aug 1998 11:19:44 -0700, [email] (Monty Ashley) wrote:

Considering the fact that this took place in a completely fictional story (written by a fictional character <grin>), Daria is more than free to make up anything she likes. Or do you really believe that Jake is a medieval knight, Helen is a toothless hag, and *ANY* state road commission could build an eight-lane highway overnight? :-)

IMHO, people are reading *FAR* too much into this. Jessie was depicted as being Jane's suitor because it fit into the story that Daria was writing. When dealing with alternate realities, anything goes, and cannot be considered "real" with regards to the continuity of the "Daria" universe. (Believe me, we sci-fi afficionadoes are well acquainted with this concept, seeing as how we're hit over the head with this plot device all the time. <grin>)

Martin ---- Quinn: Daria, you can't leave me here with those, those yuppies! Daria: Yuppies are from the 80s. Quinn: So, what do you call people with funny outfits who talk about peace and love and stuff? Daria: Trekkies. ---- To send E-mail, remove the "nospam" from my E-mail address.

In article ,

name

say

Remember, she's expressing how she *wants* her life to be like-- not how it *will* be like. Besides, she's only 16 as she writes this. Maybe she will marry the mysterious Professor Marcello (who she might've met during her semester abroad in Florence), or maybe, as she gets older, she'll want to marry some other type of guy-- y'know, a brooding artist, a brooding musician, or even a brooding writer. It's all immaterial-- the use of a future husband is just the expression of the wish to have a normal romantic life when she gets older. That she didn't mention Trent's name is obvious--she wants to keep the crush to herself, far from public view and potential embarassment. (Especially from her mother and Mr. O's view.)

See the previous para. Same thing. Nobody who's thought the whole thing through wants to have a passel of young'uns when they're 16. Hence it was reflected in her vision of herself in about 10-15 years.

What really cracked me up was the way the characters dropped in modern slang here and there during that scene. (Like Quinn's mention of Trent's car.) It gave the scene the feel of something being written down in a hurry, without the time to massage the dialogue into the proper period style. And I loved the way that Jesse said "Yeah," all the time. They really have dumbed that poor guy down-- or, I guess that Daria doesn't have much respect for Jesse's intellect.

Rich.

"Bellini taught us to see the beauty in the banal, especially since there's so much of it." -- K.I.T.H.

In article ,

Eh, I can't imagine her ever MARRYING Trent. Going out with him for a while at most (not necessarily during the run of the series.) But Trent, I assume, is Daria's first serious crush, which was existant before she even knew him very well. Not a whole lot of people get married to the first person they ever liked in high school. (Yeah, yeah, I know I'm going to get it from like a million people who married their first crush...)

In article ,

She wouldn't have said Trent because she doesn't want anyone to know she has a crush on him.

David

I think your missing the whole point of this season. Her character is becoming more three dimensional. If she stayed the same as the first season..the story would be boring...just Daria making wise cracks about those around her. Now she is more realistic. The other characters are growing as well. Helen seems to be more concerned about her daughters than the first season, Jane showed she's not as maladjusted and cynical as we first suspected. Even Trent has become a better character...he realizes that Daria can see though his facade. Quinn sees the her "friends" in the fashion club are not all they appear...what she does with this knowledge should be interesting to see.

My personal feeling is that Daria may be one the best written shows on TV now, animated or not.

Brian Smith (probably a lot older than most of you think)

[email] wrote:

I'm 36, how old are you? Anyway, I completely agree with what you said. The writing on the show is excellent. It's right up there with the best shows on TV.

In article , [email] wrote:

Shees, I'm the same...Now I can tell my wife that I'm NOT the only 36 year old who watches cartoons.

In article , [email] wrote:

I agreed with the first parts of the post, but saying that Daria is the BEST written shows on TV is going a little to far. Maybe one of the best.

David

<<I agreed with the first parts of the post, but saying that Daria is the BEST written shows on TV is going a little to far. Maybe one of the best.

David>>

Okay, then I will say it is the best written cartoon on TV. And don't even mention South Park, or The Simpsons. I have a very firm belief set on South Park. As for the Simpsons, it is a great written show, but can anyone say that this recent season was top notch?? I don't really want to start a Simpsons discussion, but if I were to choose just one cartoon to watch from here on in, it would be Daria.

In article , [email] (Jsd19) wrote:

say that

I second your opinion of Daria.

It *is* the best written animated show in current production on TV. I would even give it the edge over King Of The Hill.

I don't necessarily think "Write Where It Hurts" is a great example of this...it took time to develop and the parodies of "The Graduate" and "Sense And Sensibility" are ill omens for the future of writing quality...if they continue with this crap they'll be moving Lawndale to Springfield, if you know what I mean. It finished well, but it wasn't great.

I have yet to see the universally-hated "The Daria Hunter" yet, but I actually liked "Fair Enough" better than this one.

Hopefully the third-season writing will be good, and not follow the ominous trends I saw in "WWIH".

Take care,
--.\\<-H--

<<I don't necessarily think "Write Where It Hurts" is a great example of this...it took time to develop and the parodies of "The Graduate" and "Sense And Sensibility" are ill omens for the future of writing quality...if they continue with this crap they'll be moving Lawndale to Springfield, if you know what I mean. It finished well, but it wasn't great.>>

Well, I did like. Maybe the reason I like it more was that I didn't notice the parodies. I passed this one off as genuinely good natured episode. Now you want to talk about obvious parodies................

<<I have yet to see the universally-hated "The Daria Hunter" yet,>>

I would say don't see it, but you really should just to see how pointless an episode can be. They had such a crappy and obvious parody of Jaws, Deer Hunter, to name just two.

<< but I actually liked "Fair Enough" better than this one.>>

I'm glad someone else likes "Fair Enough", I most certainly was a minority in liking that episode. But it was not better than "Write Where it Hurts", not by a long shot.

In article ,

To jsd's comment: I agree with that this past season of the Simpsons wasn't the greatest but after nine years it gets stuff to stay on top of the game all the time(I guess that would go for any show that lasts that long).

Well, if only two out of 26 episodes had Simpson-like qualities(you have to admit that almost every episode has more parodies than the entire run of Daria), it shows me that they are just trying out something different and it isn't moving Lawndale to Springfield, yet. Those two scenes were about three minutes long total and I don't think they are cause for alarm. However, I agree that if the next two or three episodes are trying to be like the Simpsons, then the show is in danger of loosing its charm and its own identity. But by the same token, it would not be a good idea to fall in to the trap that some shows fall into: boredom from not enough variety. Parodies are probably one way to get something just a little diffrent from a 'typical' Daria episode.

BTW, I've never seen either of the movies you mentioned and while I realized that they were parodies; I didn't know of what until I read your post.

<<To jsd's comment: I agree with that this past season of the Simpsons wasn't the greatest but after nine years it gets stuff to stay on top of the game all the time(I guess that would go for any show that lasts that long).>>

My point was that Daria shows amazingly good quality for a show barely on two years. I don't know about the rest of you, but the first season and a half of the Simpson's was horrible. Yes, it gets points for being on this long. But maintaining quality is something more difficult to accomplish.

In article ,

Actually, now that I think of it, you're right. It's kind of amazing that the Simpsons even got to the third season, based on some of those early "classics"

In article , [email] wrote:

wasn't

on two

half of

long. But

<rant>Frankly I don't see why The Simpsons is still going all these years considering the quality of the LAST FEW SEASONS...</rant>

Sorry, I just had to say that.

--.\\<-H--

In article ,

Don't be sorry-- someone had to say it. I have had very little tolerance for that show for the last 3 years or so.

As for SP, it's funny in its own psychotic way, especially in the way that it sets out to intentionally tweak the moral sensibilities of the average viewer of "America's funniest home videos of cops on real tv." The problem that lies ahead for the SP creators is the urge to try to top last week's ep. And that is a problem-- each new ep must become more outrageous than the last, and it quickly becomes a parody of itself. A good example of that was Ren & Stimpy. Yes, it started out great, but quickly went into the crapper and became totally unwatchable. Literally. (Of course, "Space Madness" and "Tank Paratroopers" are my fav eps. "Eet ees not I am crazy, eet ees I who am mad!" and "Hey, Guido, it's all so clear to me now. You're the lemon merchant, and I am the keeper of the cheese. And he knows it; that's why he's trying to kill us. That's why we gotta get out of here before he sets loose the marmosets on us!")

Daria, h'er, is the best-written toon out there by far, and probably one of the best written shows overall on the tube these days. I'll put it right up there with "Frasier," and "Just Shoot Me" because all three shows are thinking persons' shows, rather than the laff-trak junk out there today.

Rich.

Centurion #1: You care if it falls?

Centurion #2: What?

Centurion #1: The Roman Empire. You care if it falls?

Centurion #2: [laughs] **** it.

In article , [email] wrote:

What happened in the case of R&S was that the creators and guiding lights of the show, Spumco, were kicked off their own show by Nickelodeon and a team of usurpers, albeit helmed by one of the original Spumco Big Shots Bob Camp, were set to milking the show for as long as they could.

Without John Kricfalusi, the creator of R&S, it went into the crapper and became totally unwatchable.

It has taken Nickelodeon from September 1992 to very, very recently before they have been able to regain the goodwill of the community of animators. The fact that almost all the people responsible for the R&S coup are gone and the last remaining culprit is on her way out has gone a long way to that end. There are even ex-Spumco loyalists involved with the "Oh Yeah! Cartoons!" shorts project supervised by ex-Cartoon Network president Fred Seibert.

I don't watch many sitcoms...the last live-action sitcom I followed regularly was "Roseanne." "King Of The Hill" could be considered an animated sitcom, perhaps. There is *nothing* in modern live-action sitcoms that exists now which can touch "The Honeymooners," "I Love Lucy," "All In The Family" and "Mary Hartman, Mary Hartman" and "Taxi." The Sitcom has been a dead, shambling corpse since the 1970s.

Daria is something beyond the Sitcom zone. It is the first truly honest look anyone has taken at high school and its discontents. It isn't "Saved By The Bell." It isn't "Beverly Hills, 90210." It isn't even "Square Pegs."

Do you think that Daria fandom would have accelerated to this level if it was just an animated sitcom?

--.\\<-H--

In article ,

You forgot "Sabrina, the Teen-age Witch." I can't even watch that show anymore -- it makes my flesh crawl, and it's not for a lack of talent (Nick Bakay, Martin Mull, and Caroline Rhea are all very funny people who have written some darn funny and original stuff before) but rather a lack of "reality," or maybe "trueness" is the right word. When a cartoon feels more real than a live-action tv show, well, that sort of speaks for itself. Of course, Disney has probably also played a role in sugar-coating the show to death.

<RAMBLE> Point taken. I agree with you that "Daria" is better than the level of quality the label "sitcom" usually implies, however, I was saying that there are a few shows out there today that, while maybe not as insightful, are truly entertaining, and are just as well-written. (Which is really a rarity these days.) I happen to particularly like "Frasier," although it has started to stall out in the past two seasons, and "Just Shoot Me" is just plain fun in a wicked sort of way. Both shows are well-written, and try to avoid the usual sitcom plot-traps. (Although the writers at "Frazier" have started to slip a little.) And I won't apologize for laughing my ass off every time I see the Seinfeld episodes "The Contest" and "The Soup Nazi," because both episodes were brilliant, even though they were neither deeply insightful or inspiring, they were excellently crafted. (But not by the Franklin Mint :D )

It's rather unrealistic to expect to see any new sitcom that could actually break new ground like "All in the Family," because that particular territory has already been discovered. And the climate of tolerance for ground-breaking sitcoms has chilled considerably. Look at what happened to "Ellen." (Although that show had the added problem of just not being very funny.) The same goes for just about any potential setting or series of issues. Wasn't it Blake who said, "There is nothing new under the sun" -- I don't have my Norton on hand, so I can't say for sure. What TV execs want is a show that follows a proven formula and can put butts in La-Z-Boys. Usually, that means derivative shows.

As for Daria, I'll agree that it's more insightful than just about any series that has attempted to explore the tough issues involved in growing up in America, but it also has the added bonus of being wickedly funny. (Unlike "James at 15," which was kind of a downer, as I remember it.) As for the show's popularity, well, any show that can strike such a universal chord in its audience will always have a large following. (See, for example, the cultlike following of "X-files"-- it strikes the chords of alienation, paranoia and fear of a government that can't even deliver mail on time.) What's more universal than feeling alienated as a teen (everyone remembers that), and fighting the urge to follow the unthinking masses'lockstep march to mediocrity? (You know, the one you always thought your parents were following until you had to earn a living on your own?) ;)

By the way, this year's Lockstep March to Mediocrity is sponsored by your local media outlet. Help us fight innovation, genius, and creativity with piles and piles of mind-numbing dreck in print, radio, tv, & film. Send us your unused dreck, or just stop by your local recycling center and deposit your material in the proper containers. Remember to sort out your derivative films, CDs, books and such. If dreck gets mixed up we may have to watch another Madonna movie, and not even the zombies want that.

</RAMBLE>

Rich.

Just trying to strike a chord of my own. :D

In article , [email] wrote:

I actually liked "The Soup Nazi" in spite of the lousy regular characters, because The Soup Nazi himself was such a funny, cool and well-crafted character. It helps that he's based on the real life "Soup Man" (don't say the Nazi word around him, he's Yemeni Jewish) Al Yeganeh. If the Seinfeld writers didn't have such a good model for a character it would have gone to mush. I have Soup Nazi screaming "No Soup For You!" as my Critical Stop sound on Windows95.

But yeah, there is still room to innovate, if you're imaginative about it. "Daria" is living proof.

Take care,
--.\\<-H--

If Daria is so original, how come at least 70% of fans think of themselves as a real life version of her? Maybe it's just that this is the first time they've been represented on TV. Although, I wouldn't want to watch a TV show about someone like me, that would really be boring to watch. Ecspecially cramming an entire crisis into 30 minutes. Plus, everything is so anti-climactic.

Michelle Klein-Hass wrote in article ...

wrote:

<snip> (I think I messed up the attrib's when I snipped, sorry in advance if I did)

if it

it.

In article , "Kyle" wrote:

Bingo.

--.\\<-H--

Or maybe this is the first time they've been represented REALISTICALLY on Tv.

[email] writes:

Ecclesiasticies 1:9

From the Jewish Publication Society translation:

"Only that shall happen Which has happened Only that shall occur Which has occured There is nothing new Beneath the sun!"

I guess I must be remembering Blake quoting scripture, then. ;)

I guess it just goes to show you that even then the technothriller and the Grisham novel were hackneyed, cliche, and trite.

Rich. (Who is sometimes embarassed to admit to sharing the same profession as John Grisham.)

In article ,

Norton

What have you written?

[email] wrote in article ...

the

John

my

there

are

series

in

I meant the other profession that Grisham and I share -- The Law. (Believe me, it's overrated. It mostly involves reading and/or writing a lot of boring documents for people with absolutely no sense of humor or adventure.) I've toyed with the idea of trying to write a little fiction for fun, but I just don't know if the world could support another damn lawyer writing another damn book. It's just so cliched. ;-)

Rich.

Jake: "I LOVE camping! I love it! ... Has anyone seen my pants?"

In article , "Kyle" wrote:

[email] wrote:

Go for it! Writing can be one of the most rewarding pursuits a person can engage in. Even if you aren't good enough to get published, or aren't interested in it, the personal satisfaction you can get out of expressing something that is important to you, and doing it well, more than pays for the effort required. - - Jonathan Sachs Sand River Software, Inc. To email me, replace the 'x' with an 'a'.

*Sigh* Thank you for the encouragement-- everyone appreciates good old-fashioned encouragement, but I was just trying to be funny in a sarcastic sort of way. I already do some writing for my own amusement-- I was a lit major in college-- it never gets out of your system. I just don't like the label, "Another Damn Lawyer With a Book." I know a lot of my fellow counselors out there are cranking away at the next generation of law-inspired "airplane books," hoping to become the next John Grisham. It's a dream of many attorneys to become a famous author-- that way you can quit worrying about making partner, and just worry about the book tour. Kinda like winning the lottery. But if I ever got published, I'd just hand in my license to practice, just to avoid becoming part of a cliche. ;-)

Tongue-in-cheekily, Rich.

P.S. Or maybe not. I like the way my license looks on the wall, and God knows, I went through enough BS to get it.

In article , [email] wrote:

just

In article , "Kyle" wrote:

I assume he's an attorney, not a writer.

You'll find us everywhere - even on alt.tv.daria.

p.s. Helen cracks me up. She's not realistic as a lawyer, but she's a great parody.

Oh yeah, forgot Grisham is an attorney in real life.

Steven Appelget wrote in article ...

In article , [email] (Steven Appelget) wrote:

Helen is a sort of an amalgam of a lot of attorneys I've worked with. I loved it when she complained about getting her interoffice mail "sometime before nightfall." Having done some R/E work, I know that feeling of wanting to reach through the phone and give the lender a big ol' slap for not getting the damn loan package in on time. I also know the pressure of trying to get everything ready for a big case going to trial at the last minute, too. (One of the reasons I left litigation for R/E... that, and the more humane office hours.) :D

Rich.

Jake: "I LOVE camping! I love it! ... Has anyone seen my pants?"

P.S. Actually, Jake reminds me of a few attys I've had to deal with, too. I remember one of my classmates in law school actually stood up on top of a table and screamed obscenities at the competition in a moot court negotiation competition. The situation was supposed to be some sort of an equitable distribution negotiation, where he had invited the other parties to discuss a proposed settlement in a mythical divorce. Instead, he screamed at them to get out of his %%$*$* (^%&% ^%^ %$@^ office and such. Needless to say, he didn't make the team, but it sure makes a good story.

In article ,

I also read alt.tv.simpsons and that thought is in the majority. Most people think that the 3rd, 4th and 5th season were the best and the rest sucks by comparison.

In article , [email] (Jsd19) wrote:

I do think Daria is the best written cartoon on TV, but not the best show. I was simply saying that I didn't think Daria was the best show. I didn't think you, or anyone else, would attack my opinion. Although, you, and others (you more though), have a tendency to attack, or flame, anything that's said.

David

In article , [email] wrote:

Also, I don't think Daria is the best cartoon. Just the best written that I've seen. It would probally come #2 on my list. I'm partial to "Rugrats" myself, but Daria has better plots and more creative. I hope this clears things up.

David

<<Also, I don't think Daria is the best cartoon. Just the best written that I've seen. It would probally come #2 on my list. I'm partial to "Rugrats" myself, but Daria has better plots and more creative. I hope this clears things up.>>

I'm going to be honest. I have never scene Rugrats, and I have no reason to watch it. Can anyone offer a sufficient justification to watch it? From what I see it's nothing more than a nickelodeon kiddie cartoon, with nothing inherently adult. Can anyone tell me different? I would really like to know.

what

It is not something a "The Simpsons", "King of the Hill", or "Daria" person would like. In other words, it's not anything like thoese cartoons. It's about how 6 babies act and how they talk when grown-ups aren't around and how they get in trouble. The reason others and I watch the show is becasue of the dialect and the personalities of the charactors. The reason I said Daria is more creative is because the basic plot of Rugrats is the same. The babies talk to each other, go off on their own, get in trouble, etc. The same things happen every episode only in a different situation. Although, I still love to watch it. I would probally watch Daria over Rugrats. You might get a better idea if you either wacth on episdoe, or goto: http//saginaw.simplenet.com/index.htm. It gives all info on Rugrats neeeded. I have to stop typing now. I know you all are getting tired of me.

David

In article , [email] wrote:

think

I didn't mean "attack." I meant disagree. I don't want you to think that I'm "attacking" you. Okay I've blabbed for quite some time now. I'm done.

David

<<I do think Daria is the best written cartoon on TV, but not the best show. I was simply saying that I didn't think Daria was the best show. I didn't think you, or anyone else, would attack my opinion. Although, you, and others (you more though), have a tendency to attack, or flame, anything that's said.

It's all in a matter of taste. I do prefer animation over say, a sitcom. Let's say for the sake of arguement that Senfeld was the greatest show. I would still second it to Daria, because I prefer animation over live action, and I prefer the premise as well.

That new NBC show coming out next Wednesday looks pretty promising. "Stressed Eric"?

Jsd19 wrote in article ...

BEST

even

South

say that

Simpsons

on in,

I haven't seen it, all I can say is that it's English, so don't get your hopes up too much. (See my earlier post on South Park)

Shadowcloak [email] http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/Museum/7252/

"Must... stick... head... cold... water..." - Jane Lane

That's true

Shadoc64 wrote in article ...

hopes

"The Simpsons' is a lot more hit-or-miss than it used to be, but it's been on so long that it's understandable. "Daria" and "King of the Hill" are more consistently excellent. As for "South Park"--I'm not sure why I like it. I guess it's because of the sheer outrageousness of it all--which, I suppose, stems from the writing. (It's certainly not due to animation quality!) But I still wouldn't put it with "Daria" and "KOTH".

In article , [email] wrote:

David, Thats what I said, one of the best. No flame intended.

Oh, and I'm aware that I misspelled the episodes title.

Me? Okay, I admit it. I got just a little tiny bit misty-eyed.

I thought this was *wonderful*.

I disagree with you, Jsd19, that she was out of character to start with. Those hostile emotions and moments of self-doubt are part of who she is as much as the cynical facade is, or as much as doing stupid things occasionally is. That's what happens when someone writes a character who *isn't* one dimensional, who *isn't* a characature.

This wasn't a terribly funny episode. I didn't laugh out loud once, although I smiled a few times. But I would have enjoyed it *less* if it was really funny. Here was an episode of a cartoon that let us actually explore character.

This may end up as one of my favorite episodes.

• Ian

<<I disagree with you, Jsd19, that she was out of character to start with.>>

Well you opinion. But if Glen Eichler wrote more episodes, we wouldn't even be having this debate.

[email] (Jsd19) wrote:

Well, considering this ep. was written by the story editor/executive producer/creator, people probably will get on your case for saying that. If you won't accept her actions from him, I don't see the point in arguing with you.

Mark

<<Well, considering this ep. was written by the story editor/executive producer/creator, people probably will get on your case for saying that. If you won't accept her actions from him, I don't see the point in arguing with you.>>

Uh, uh, uh. Don't even start with "the creator is the best person for the creation" speech. I'm a guy who reads comics, so you really don't want to go there. I've seen creative teams do wonders beyond the original creators of comics characters. I'm not saying that Glen isn't great for Daria, but if you're saying that somewhere down the line there would never be someone who has a better take, than you're sadly mistaken.

< -- snip -- >

you know, when you summarize the episodes like that, they sound pretty damn stupid.

<< you know, when you summarize the episodes like that, they sound pretty damn stupid.>>

So, you finally realized those episodes were stupid?? ;) Seriously, that's my interpretation of it.

On 4 Aug 1998 04:52:36 GMT, [email] (Jsd19) wrote:

Now, if you could just get beyond your fixation on the trees and start paying attention to the forest as a whole... ;-)

Martin ---- Quinn: Daria, you can't leave me here with those, those yuppies! Daria: Yuppies are from the 80s. Quinn: So, what do you call people with funny outfits who talk about peace and love and stuff? Daria: Trekkies. ---- To send E-mail, remove the "nospam" from my E-mail address.

<<Now, if you could just get beyond your fixation on the trees and start paying attention to the forest as a whole... ;-)>>

I am, and I see a whole forrest full of crappy, dried out, burnt up trees.

Jsd19 wrote:

Then turn around and don't look at it.

<<Then turn around and don't look at it.>>

Can't, I'm busy searching for the regular looking trees.

On Tue, 04 Aug 1998 00:14:06 -0500, aeroplane wrote:

It's called "not seeing the forest for the trees". :-) I'd probably take the same tack on those elements if I didn't consider them in the context of their entire episodes (and the series itself).

Martin ---- Quinn: Daria, you can't leave me here with those, those yuppies! Daria: Yuppies are from the 80s. Quinn: So, what do you call people with funny outfits who talk about peace and love and stuff? Daria: Trekkies. ---- To send E-mail, remove the "nospam" from my E-mail address.

In article , [email] (Jsd19) wrote:

hostile.

write a

<snip>

As many interesting insights and provocative views as you have about the show, jsd19, you're continued "out of character" claims for Daria are a one-note symphony that is consistently flat.

There wasn't a moment in this WWIH that Daria was even giving a sideways glance toward "out of character" land.

Do you really see Daria's character as two-dimensional as the drawing?

-TDH

<<As many interesting insights and provocative views as you have about the show, jsd19, you're continued "out of character" claims for Daria are a one-note symphony that is consistently flat.

There wasn't a moment in this WWIH that Daria was even giving a sideways glance toward "out of character" land.

Do you really see Daria's character as two-dimensional as the drawing?>>

Are you going to continue to be this snooty?? If so, you'll never get my answer.

In article , [email] (Jsd19) wrote:

Somehow...I think we'll all live. Keep it to yourself if it's such a big deal.

-TDH

<<Somehow...I think we'll all live. Keep it to yourself if it's such a big deal.>>

I'm not going to respond to someone who wants to turn their nose up at whatever I say. You obviously don't care what I have to say anyway, so what's the point in an answer?

In article ,

**looks at this message, stops, thinks** So, you felt compelled to tell us that you're not going to respond... by responding? um, call me country bumpkin, but where's the logic in that? Oh wait, this is Usenet. Carry on.

                                               Is this officially a troll?
                                                    Cappadocius

<<**looks at this message, stops, thinks** So, you felt compelled to tell us that you're not going to respond... by responding? um, call me country bumpkin, but where's the logic in that? Oh wait, this is Usenet. Carry on.>>

Good idea, I think I will stop, just to shut you up. Incidently, what is you deal anyway?? I have an opinion, what's wrong with it? No, wait you told me the problem but what is it any of your business if I think someone is out of character or not. It's not as if it's a completely implausible notion. To each is own, learn to respect it. I'm sure others share my beliefs, although they may not all exist on this board.

In article ,

ooooookay, this is against my better judgement, but check your headers kiddo. I'm not the one who's been telling you you have a problem. That's someone else entirely, all I did was try my hand at pointing out the absurdity of your replying to this gent to tell him you're not replying. I apparently failed miserably. Please be a bit more careful before snapping at people.

                                                 yay! I'm officially a troll!
                                                   naughty Cappadocius

On Wed, 05 Aug 1998 08:02:11 -0700, [email] (Snooty) wrote:

I hated to do it, but I finally had to just stop responding to him for the very reasons you cite. Yes, I'll probably end up missing out on the occasional good post from him, and I do regret that (I've never liked having to invoke a filter on someone, not even when they deserved it). But, it's like repeatedly hitting your head on a brick wall: It's not healthy, and it feels *so* good to stop. :-)

Martin ---- Quinn: Daria, you can't leave me here with those, those yuppies! Daria: Yuppies are from the 80s. Quinn: So, what do you call people with funny outfits who talk about peace and love and stuff? Daria: Trekkies. ---- To send E-mail, remove the "nospam" from my E-mail address.

<< hated to do it, but I finally had to just stop responding to him for the very reasons you cite. Yes, I'll probably end up missing out on the occasional good post from him, and I do regret that (I've never liked having to invoke a filter on someone, not even when they deserved it). But, it's like repeatedly hitting your head on a brick wall: It's not healthy, and it feels *so* good to stop. :-)

Martin>>

Excuse me, but are you talking to me??? And if so, just what the fuck is your deal anyway???? I'm suppose to lie down and accept what you say at face value???? I have my opinions, and I'll stick with. I don't care if the majority is against me, I stick firmly by my beliefs.