The End vs. College

This is a topic I believe has been brought up in here before, but I thought it deserves a thread all to itself. (Awfully greedy, isn't it?) If MTV decides to keep Daria on the air for a few more years, should the series continue beyond graduation, or should Daria be retired and doomed to a life of reruns?

Sure, it'd be great to have new episodes far into the future. However, where would Daria go after high school? I assume she'd go to college because she's not really the rebel she wants to think that she is. It's nice to believe that one is different and unique, but, in reality, nothing is new and people ARE replacable. She'd have to follow the system that works, and going to college after high school works for most people in most situations.

Daria: The College Years.... How long could that actually go on? Except her family, just about every other character on the show would have to be thrown out, including Jane. I don't think Daria would choose a college that she knew would contain some people from Lawndale, and Jane definately would not choose the same university as Daria. It would be extremely difficult for the writers to continue the series after having one of the favorite characters almost completely removed. Possibly, they could have some of the episodes focus on Daria at her science or literature university and other episodes focus on Jane and her artsy endeavors (college or otherwise). Also, they could have another show branch off and have "Jane" as a whole separate series. Then again...probably not.

Therefore, maybe it would be better for Daria to gently bow out after graduation. Her valedictorian (or salutatorian if Jodie beats her) speech would be a respectable series finale. Of course, we'll miss the excitement of new episodes, but would those new episodes really be worth missing anyway?

-----> Violator's Toad <-----

In article ,

However,

reality,

Lawndale,

At the same time, I think the college setting could open up a lot of new possibilities (How will Daria react to her new independance? Having a roommate? Might she actually get homesick for Lawndale?), and after all, they can invent new characters. It'd be tough to top Jane, or even equal her, but you could always have Daria talk to Jane on the phone everyonce in a while. I think the show could stand to FF Daria's high school years a bit...if we have to wait three more years for a college season to be a possibility, it'll be a long shot.

the

--That would be a fitting end, too, but as I hear it, Gleen Eichler & Co.'s plans are to have her move into college eventually. Tice Rust

Daria code: A D+ T2 W- Q++ Fn^Fr O+ Oo+Os m++ c++ MV F:111,210,313 BB FCJ -DT- q+ fJ^fD

Violator's Toad said:

She's also a smart girl who would really benefit from college, both personally and professionally.

College isn't essential in life, but it helps. Both her parents are college graduates, and she will probably follow in their footsteps.

As long as MTV keeps buying it. I'd sure as hell watch it.

Well ... no, even if Jane didn't go to the same college, Daria wouldn't stop being her friend. She just wouldn't get to see her all the time.

She doesn't really hate everyone in Lawndale. She hates SOME of them, and pretends to hate others.

Why not? They might choose the same colleges specifically to be near one another. They're good friends, after all.

Write in new characters. It's been done before.

If well written, they would be.

Sincerely Yours, Jordan

"Man, as we know him, is a poor creature; but he is halfway between an ape and a god and he is travelling in the right direction." (Dean William R. Inge)

[email] (Jordan S. Bassior) wrote:

As would I. It's one of the best-written shows on the tube these days-- heck, I'd rather watch "Just Add Water" or DTAH over anything else the Webs offer. (Unless, of course, there's that special "Two Guys and a Girl" episode where the cast is eaten by sharks-- you know, a "Two Guys and a Girl/Shark Week" cross-over. <g> I'd watch THAT.)

Besides, Jane would probably go to Art School, and there are a lot of great schools either in or near great Liberal Arts Schools. Heck, Jane could go to CalArts while Daria goes to UCLA. Or Columbia and, um, no, wait, Julliard is a conservatory... damn... I know there are good Art Schools in NY... and Columbia has a world renowned school of Journalism... anyway, rent isn't cheap in NYC. You know what I mean.

It's funny-- my best friend from HS and I both went to the same university-- he was 2 years older than me, but it made the good times that much better, and the bad times a little easier to endure. It'd make a great area of exploration for the series.

And I don't see Kevin or Brittany getting into the same calibre of College that Daria would, unless, of course, she perversely decided to go to a smaller, less pompous school. But Jodie and Mack are both destined for top colleges-- Mack has proven time and time again that he's very sharp.

The other odd thing from my experience-- 30 people from my HS wound up at UNC with me as well. And I thought I could escape them! ;-) (Actually, though, you can escape a lot of people in college, if you want to isolate yourself that way. It's very easily done.)

Yep. See above.

I'd love to see what the "Daria" staff made up for college profs, students, and administrators. I bet it'd be great TV.

And if y'all don't send in your letters, or use those Nielsen boxes, it's all a moot point, anyway. Write, Dammit! Gah!

rich.

Quinn: People are so weird!

Daria: Some are weird. Some are just astonishingly self-centered and deceitful.

On Wed, 27 Oct 1999 21:58:36 GMT, [email] (paperpusher) wrote:

And we really, really need a counter to "Felicity."

Again(*) I ask, will they listen to a Canadian voice?

* - I may have trashed the message where I first asked that... I toss a lot of messages

[email] wrote:

Of course! In fact, I've heard from several Australian folks who're sending letters, too. MTV needs to know that there's an international audience. Every voice needs to be heard! (Even if the voice says "Eh?" every now and then. ;-)

rich.

Jane: You know, I don't know why people say we have a bad attitude.

Daria: Screw 'em.

On 27 Oct 1999 01:22:05 GMT, [email] (Jordan S. Bassior) wrote:

Course, they could always give in to the 'shippers and make Jane family... (Ugh. Dunno how they'd pull it off, not even sure if I want to know; but if they get desperate enough to keep the Lanes involved, they'll do it.)

Jane has about a C average. I have difficulty seeing her accepted to anything post-secondary that doesn't specialize in art.

So unless Daria rejects the Ivy League out of principle or something... (maybe they wouldn't take her due to 'attitude problems' or something.)

OTOH, I kept contact with my friends after going to university. Course, the university was local (and decent, though not ivy-league.)

I'd almost expect a spin-off instead, featuring a liked but underdeveloped character. Kinda like the way Daria grew out of Beavis and Butthead.

But who? My vote is for Andrea...

I think that's what he was questioning... whether they could be well written.

[email] wrote:

Well, as I said before-- if both got into schools in the same major city...

Unfortunately, Susie Lewis, who did the voice of Andrea, is no longer with the show. (Drat!) I guess they could always recast, considering that we've heard Andrea utter, what, 3-4 lines? (Although they were all quality laffs...)

Sure! All it takes is a little creativity, and a willingness for MTV to follow through with a series that has tons of untapped potential.

And look at it this way-- if they string the series out into college, they can keep the 'shippers in limbo for another, what, 10 years? (With 1 Lawndale Year = 2 Real Years.) Muahaha! ;-)

rich.

"Unethical is only two letters away from ethical..." -- Paul Michael Mercurio

On Thu, 28 Oct 1999 04:33:39 GMT, [email] (paperpusher) wrote:

<snip>

That's just evil! Evil I tell you! Evil! Pure Evil! Damn it rich, you're good. :)

Nicole Lee Also known as LadyKender on IRC and ICQ.

The Darianite Revolution at http://members.xoom.com/nlsy/daria.htm Kendermore at http://members.xoom.com/nlsy/ The Nicole Chronicles at http://members.xoom.com/nlsy/press.htm

"But I don't want to be in any 'inner circle cabal thing.'" -Hallucinating Elvis Lady to SpaceRanger on atd-

Daria Code: A D T3 Ws Q+ FN^Fr O- OH+Oo+Od m- c+++ MV C5X F:111,213,313 BB- FCD +DT q fN

[email] (Nicole Lee) wrote:

So evil, I'm good, huh? Thanks. ;-) Too bad that evil doesn't pay too well these days. ;-)

dastardly, rich.

Jane: You know, I don't know why people say we have a bad attitude.

Daria: Screw 'em.

In article ,

rich, you don't happen to know someone or have a manservant by the name of Hecubus, do you? :-)

(10 points to whomever figures out the name of the show I'm referring to. C'mon, this is an easy one!)

A.J

In article , [email] wrote:

Kids in the Hall (that was evil, I mean easy)

Evil!!!!

[email] wrote:

Maaaaybe I do, maaaaybe I don't. But if I told you either way, it wouldn't be Eeee-vil! Ha, ha, still evil after all these years!

Sir Simon-- I mean, rich.

Mr. O'Neill: Let's pledge to make Daria's dream a reality!

Daria: You mean the one where people walking down the street burst into flames?

Mr. O'Neill: The coffeehouse!

[email] wrote:

Duh! Kids In The Hall, of course! Have *you* seen the movie "Presumed Innocent"? ;-{)>

MIKE (a.k.a. "Progbear")

make GEORYN disappear to reply

"It is not an obscenity to be free. It is a divine right." --Annette Peacock

N.P.:"Serenade"- M a r i a / 7 0 ' s W e s t J a p a n e s e R o c k S c e n e

Kaos said:

??? The obvious way for Jane to become "family"would be for Daria to marry Trent. Which doesn't look like it's going to happen anytime SOON, but could reasonably enough happen someday years from now.

Maybe Daria goes to a college that also has a major art program? Or they go to different colleges in the same city and live together?

I know someone highly intelligent who is avoiding going to the better of two colleges because it is also the more Politically Correct one.

Quite possibly. I bet some Goths are groaning at the portrayal of the Goth scene on "Downtown" ...

Sincerely Yours, Jordan

"Man, as we know him, is a poor creature; but he is halfway between an ape and a god and he is travelling in the right direction." (Dean William R. Inge)

I love this idea! It could be the spin-off of the spin-off, and could spawn it's own offshoots, and eventually cynical animation would take over MTV! Mu-hahahahah! Andrea's a good choice, though post-Jane's Addition, they could do an MKH and have a whole Trent thing, which might have much the same effact as Angel/Buffy, lol.

More pi in the face (nyuk, nyuk, nyuk) <-- {bonus points for telling me where THIS is from, and the book doesn't count :) } from [address]!

On 28 Oct 1999 21:42:28 GMT, [email] (Jordan S. Bassior) wrote:

Er... yeah. That's why I called it "giving in to the 'shippers."

And the first part, is why I said "dunno how they'd pull it off." Probably take a little bit of set-up in the episodes leading up to it; I suppose it could be done... (don't mind me, I'm still waiting for season three.)

I'd favor the last one; Jane was on academic probation for (language arts? english?) which, if my college experience is anything to go by, is a requirement for every program. And also one of the marks they use to determine eligibility.

I could see Daria rejecting them simply because she's expected to go to one.

I never planned to consider any myself; but then I slacked off in high school and didn't get the grades I should have anyway.

I don't get MTV; I have to watch Daria filtered through YTV. Which means no "Downtown" for me...

And the bastards at YTV dropped Daria this week for the New Addams Family. I pray it's just a halloween thing.

Kaos said:

Well, it would take years of buildup to avoid looking really hokey. Considering that their relationship is nowhere near that point right now.

Serena (Alex's love interest) is a goth. She's also kind of ... well ... experienced, and one ep where they showed her "goth scene" was clearly based on the S&M and vampire sub-sub-cultures of the goth subculture. Which is not what ALL goths are into ...

Sincerely Yours, Jordan

"Man, as we know him, is a poor creature; but he is halfway between an ape and a god and he is travelling in the right direction." (Dean William R. Inge)

So would I unless it degressed to a point of complete and utter stupidity. I guess it probably wouldn't, but you never know....it IS empty-v...

wouldn't stop

I didn't say they wouldn't be friends. It's just very doubtful they would see each other every episode. Phone calls, maybe...but even that would taper off and perhaps eventually end in real life. Plus, phone calls usually don't add much to a story line.

Lawndale,

and

I guess that was just me confusing my life with Daria's life again! :) While I wouldn't rule out a college just because someone from my school is going there, that college would definately get knocked down a few spots on my "ultimate university list". Then again, there are only 60 people in my class, so that gives me the opportunity to get to know the people well enough to hate them all. Just kidding...or not.

one

Hmmm...I think they would like to go to the same college, but selectivity and classes offered would probably keep them from actually doing so. I guess if you think Daria is going on to journalism (liberal arts), they might go to the same university. However, there is a lot of pressure for top students to go onto engineering, so I wouldn't be surprised if Daria went into some science-related topic instead. Liberal Arts Colleges usually don't offer very strong science programs (I know there are some exceptions, so don't get angry with me!) or they just offer pre-programs and you have to take the real classes somewhere else anyway.

-----> Violator's Toad <-----

In article ,

Being and engineer myself, while I do see that students who show excellence in math and science are encouraged to persue degrees in enginnering or science related field, I would hardly call this encouragement pressure since a lot of those students are obviously better in these areas (while still good in non-science) and want to take these courses of studies, anyway. Daria, IMO, would be in a different category in that she is just as excellent in everything, so she would have more leverage to decide on a career path of her choosing. So, I think Daria would be able to decide to take whatever she wants. If she wants to be an engineer, journalist, chemist, actor or whatever; she'll be able to.

I can't really comment, except to say that the Liberal Arts College here at Villanova scares me, and for all I know, it's on another planet ;)

We don't have much contact with them, and it's better off that way, for all of us ;)

Mike Quinn wrote:

Funny-- I never saw Daria as the engineer type. I always saw her as the writer type. Besides, there are a number of allusions made in the show and the books that indicate that what she really wants to do is write for a living. I don't know if that'd predispose her to something like journalism or perhaps creative writing, but either way, I don't really see her in the gene-splicing lab.

As a liberal ars grad, I can say that I know what you mean. And, yes, I've been in courses that have sometimes scared the crap out of me, and had me run, not just walk, to the drop table. (And others I was too interested in to worry about my grades, even though they were absolute bears.) Engineering always struck me as one of those areas where you pretty much learn a foreign language and adopt an alien culture. ;-) My relationships with machines are very formal-- too formal for engineering.

rich.

Aww, come on! Liberal arts folks are fun! Jooooin us! JOOOIIN US!

rich.

Quinn: I can't be a brain! My friends will hate me!

In article , [email] wrote:

I've never actually dropped a course, but the closest I ever got to that was with a course called, I kid you not, "Engineering in the Humanistic Context." All we talked about was the Challenger accident and how so many people died in the construction of the Brooklyn Bridge.

I've never thought about it that way but I see what you mean. My dad asked me what I'm going to concentrate on in grad school and I told him that I would learn to specialize in microwave theory and design. He then jokingly asked "Well then you can tell me why our microwave doesn't ever cook anything evenly?" The look on his face when I actually explained it was priceless (sort of a combo between "I can't believe you answered that" and "What in the world are you talking about?"). Let's just say, my dad never asks me about my studies anymore.

I didn't say you guys weren't fun, but if our Engineering building was anywhere near out Liberal Arts center, it wouldn't work. To use a bad analogy, both us enginers and you artsy types are like a couple of electrons - we repel each other, and we get out of control if we spend too much time near each other when we're trying to work ;>

Mike Quinn wrote in message news:7vcauf$pm4$[email]...

actually

there

take

I doubt that somehow. I did quite well at science, loving it as I do, but received no encouragement to go into any science or engineering field. I was told instead that I wasn't college material. An ACT composite score in the 96th percentile just wasn't good enough and a ACT science score in the 99th percentile didn't indicate sufficient ability in science. I was particularly hamstrung by my 88th percentile score in math. So being told I'd never be able to make it in college I gave up on a career in science or engineering.

I'd very much like to know just what more I could have done.

On Thu, 28 Oct 1999 21:09:57 GMT, Violator's Toad wrote:

Which is why I doubt we'll see her in that field.

Jodie, maybe... Jodie does what is expected of her. Daria only does what's needed. Under duress. And with many objections.

[email] wrote:

Nah, Jodie will prolly get pressured to do something like a combined JD/MBA program, or a JD/MS (Public Policy) program, after she graduates with Highest Honors in something like History or Poli Sci. I know Jodie very, very, very, VERY well. (Let's just say that out of 650 students in my class, I had the 3rd longest list of extracurriculars-- yes, I was an extracurricular ho, and the other Jodie-types I knew in HS I all met up with again in law school, but by then I was too burned out to try a joint-degree program. But I digress.)

extracurricularly yours, rich.

Jake: Who do you want in an emergency? Superman, or your *damn inner child?*

In article , Violator's Toad wrote: See my first post in the Daily Dose rant thread for more of a reply, but as to whats in this thread: > This is a topic I believe has been brought up in here before, but I

Whatever goals she wants to pursue in life she'll probably need to have some sort of college degree and I think she knows this(even if it means admittng Helen was right about this all along).

Not all the characters would have to be thrown out, a lot of them yes, but not all. As I mentioned in the other thread, the Lawndale high faculty could be around for at least the 7th and 8th seasons, because Quinn is still going to Lawndale high as a senior at this point, so they wouldn't have to be thrown away, at least not right away, they may be stale plot devices at this time in the series run, but if fresh ideas can come from them, then by all means do so!

Though not my favorites, you need a Kevin and Brittany, or at least their college equivalents, being a show emphasizing stereotypes, the college jock and cheerleader lines would be just as relevant as the high school ones, plus you just don't get rid of good comic relief do you? Daria needs someone to throw sarcastic barbs at while at college.

Jane could just as easily go to the same college as Daria, being the close friends they are. My best friend Mark and I went to he same college after graduation, and I'm sure it's not an umcommon thing for that to happen.

I don't think Daria would

See above regarding Jane.

As I said in the other thread, I'd have to agree. The Lawndale high graduation ceremonies would be THE perfect series finale.

Of course, we'll miss the

If the writers can come up with new, fresh ideas and continue the great writing, then I'd gladly be proven wrong and hope the show lasts well into her college years. Either way, whenever and however the end comes, the new episodes will be greatly missed.

My prediction: 6 seasons, but will gladly be proven wrong and have it last for years more.

For more, again see my first post in the "What's up with the Daily Dose" thread.

He who should really stop rambling on now,

A.J

On Wed, 27 Oct 1999 06:51:24 GMT, [email] wrote:

Freelance writer. A college degree *may* offer a touch of credibility to potential publishers, but not nearly as much as having an article published...

Then again, would she avoid a college just because there might be Lawndalers there? She's too smart to do that. And too cynical to beleive that a college elsewhere wouldn't have 'the same only different' people.

In article ,

Well at some point Daria going to be "doomed to a life of reruns" anyway, might as well br after she graduates (they can always do an ANIMATED movie, if there's an audience for it).

Whenever I hear the phrase "The College Years" I think Saved By the Bell <shudder>

At most we would probably see would be Daria leaving for/arriving at college. That could be a good end of series episode where Daria leaves Lawndale and everyone she knows behind and start anew a some place of "higher" learning.

Mike "The Mighty" Quinn responded (to previous post):

Or worse. Imagine it becoming something like "Beverly Hills 90210" -- ths show started out focusing on high schoolers, followed them into college, & now looks at them as adults. Good idea, except that they've become BORING AS HELL. This show has been on WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY too long.

This is a potential dilemma with Daria : it could keep going & going a la Energizer Bunny & eventually run out of gas. That said, I STILL want to see the show go on through high school graduation. I want to see Seasons Five AND Six, and told Mr. Graden so in my letter.

If you haven't yet told Mr. Graden how you feel about Daria, do so now. Send your letters to:

Brian Graden Executive Vice President of Programming MTV Networks 1515 Broadway New York, NY 10036-5797

Save Daria (from becoming like 90210). Campaign for quality as well as quantity.

Cricket

In article , Violator's Toad writes:

Or Girl Meets World... How about if the faculty from the HS all move up to the local college and Jake loses his job and Daria, to save money, decides to attend the local college... And Jodie can come back to Lawndale after trying an ivy league school and finding it too competative... Mack and Kevin, who both got sports scolarships, both get injured (Kevin's fault) and only Lawndale College will take them... Brittany will want to follow her Kevie to make sure no other girls steal him... Jane decides to study art at LC, too since at least, she is familiar with the craziness that abounds in Lawndale... and Upchuck decides to attend LC when he can't get into any frats and his two favorite fiesty ladies will be there, anyway... grrrrl...

Marie

"You're so stupid, think now lf we blow him up to smithereens We may lose some pieces And then Jack will beat us black and green" -Shock from "Kidnap the Sandy Claws" (from The Nightmare Before Christmas)

In article ,

geez, that's going a bit far.

It's a cartoon, so anything is possible without explanation.

However... For Jane, respectable colleges are known to also have respectable art schools that aren't all that difficult to get into. Art school admissions are portfolio-based, so it's talent, not smarts, that matter more. I went to particularly large art school myself, one that was just a "School of" a larger general studies college (ie: Lawndale School of Humanities, School of Medicine, School of Art, etc...). If it's a huge college, it would have study courses for everything. Besides, lots of places have a college that most local high school kids end up going to together. "Lawndale College" wouldn't be a bad idea for most of the characters to transplant into. There was even a bonafide fashion school where I went to college! Ha! The only thing my college was missing was a football team.

I personally would *love* to see Daria in a college setting. High school is so overrated in tv shows. College is way more interesting. There's just more wierdness there to explore.

http://animation.acmecity.com/model/347/main.html Visit this page. It is full of great cartoon art!

Buster Logan wrote:

The same thing goes for schools of music as well-- if you're good enough, you can get in just about anywhere, and they won't really scrutinize your application as closely if you have a killer audition. Funny, that, considering the prior discussion about athletics in schools-- it's almost the same thing-- music schools recruit as well, always trying to get the best musicians to come there. Some even offer scholarships based on ability.

Amen, brother! HS was downright dull compared to my college years. Of course, these days, they've managed to suck a lot of the fun out of college... but there's still ample fodder for weirdness and sarcasm. ;-)

rich.

Jane: Usually when I have this dream I'm wearing pink taffeta.

and Jake

college...

and

scolarships,

them...

steal him...

with the

LC when he

there,

Aaaaahhhh! Funny! Then, after they all graduate, Jodie will start a software company in town called Lawndale Software Inc. (Creative title, eh?) Mack will be co-owner of the company, and soon after they will be married. Mack will stay home to raise the children when the time comes, while Jodie will still be heavily involved with everything in the company and community. Brittany will use her "amazing capabilities" to become part time office help while she starts bringing up all of the little Kevy juniors running around. Kevin, of course, would *have* to work at Lawndale Inc while he's waiting for some pro- football team to take up his contract (fat chance). He could be the "smooth talking salesman"...or at least make people pity him enough to support the business. Upchuck would be one of the managers of the company and would have numerous sexual harrassment lawsuits against him. Jane could easily find a job in the graphics department while drawing disturbing carictures at local fairs as a part-time job/hobby. Andrea would be around there somewhere, I'm sure, but it wouldn't really matter anyway because you'd only see her in one out of five episodes and she wouldn't say anything anyway. Where would Daria fit into all of this? She would write the owners manuals for the programs because those manuals usually seem like they're written by a super intelligent person who thinks everyone else in the world either has an IQ of 8 or that everyone else should know every single detail about computers before they buy one stupid program...

-----> Violator's Toad <-----

On Thu, 28 Oct 1999 21:37:29 GMT, Violator's Toad wrote:

Nope. Shoe Salesman.

(yes, I used to watch "Married... With Children."

I must be getting different manuals. Most of the ones I wind up with seem to expect you to have graduated from Computer Sciences (or engineering) with about 3 years in the field.